The House met at 10:03 a.m.

[The Speaker in the chair.]

Routine Business

Prayers and reflections: Kiel Giddens.

Introductions by Members

Nina Krieger: It’s with great excitement and pride that I introduce students representing the Reynolds Reybots robotic team from Victoria’s Reynolds Secondary in my riding.

[10:05 a.m.]

Welcome Oliver Herman, Sarah Mass, Riley Vos, Brianna Davis, Joel Rider, Calvin Spindlow, Taya Anderson, Nicholas Bernhardt, Tyler Stocks and Tyler Stigney.

These exceptional students are headed to the FIRST Robotics World Championship in Houston next week. Please join me in a warm welcome and in wishing them the very best for their upcoming competition.

Kiel Giddens: I’d like to welcome Chris Atchison and the B.C. Construction Association, as well as construction associations from across the province. These companies do amazing work to build our province, and I know all members will have a chance to speak with them at their event this evening. Will the House please make them all very welcome today.

Hon. Jennifer Whiteside: We are so fortunate to be joined in the gallery this morning by members from MoveUP. MoveUP represents 13,000 union members across both the public and private sectors in British Columbia. Their members do fundamentally important work to support British Columbians.

Please join me in welcoming Annette Toth, president; Rysa Kronebusch, vice president; Christy Slusarenko, vice president; Dimitri Ossinsky, vice president; Norman Gludovatz; Brenda Chu; Anderson Charles; Brian Martens; Lana Topic; Leilah Thiel; Kim Mcinroy; Gurinder Dhandwal; Daniel Fung; Sharan Pawa; Noah Berson; Javed Saheb; Natalie Hoedel; Safar Alikhani.

They will be talking about the important issues and work that their members do over the next couple of days. Would the House please join me in making them feel very welcome.

David Williams: With us today is one of my constituency assistants, Ross Breitkreuz, along with his father, Ernie.

I’d like to welcome them all the way here from Sicamous, and I hope they enjoy the day at the Leg.

Hon. Christine Boyle: Today joining us in the gallery from Doig River First Nation are Chief Trevor Makadahay, Councillors Justin Davis and Star Acko and Shona Nelson.

I had the pleasure of meeting with Chief Makadahay last week, and I look forward to speaking with the team more later today to discuss the important work they’re doing for their community.

I will also note that Doig River First Nation chief and council are also joined in the House today by someone very familiar to this place, former MLA Dan Davies. So I ask the House to join me in making them feel welcome.

Hon. Garry Begg: I am pleased today to welcome Maurine Karagianis, a long-time member of this House for many years back. Today I hope the House will make them truly welcome.

Hon. Brittny Anderson: It is with great delight today that I welcome Ryland Stokes here in the Legislature.

Ryland is from the Kootenays, from the East Shore. He graduated from L.V. Rogers last year, and now he’s studying political science at the University of Victoria and really enjoying his studies. So he’ll get to watch question period today, and then we’re going to go on a tour of the Legislature. So if everyone in this House could please make Ryland feel very, very welcome.

Hon. Lana Popham: I just love it when constituents take time out of their busy lives to come and visit us at the Legislature. Today we are welcoming Roger Boutilier from Saanich South. Roger is visiting today with the Brentwood Bay Probus Club and getting a tour of the Legislature. I’ve never met Roger before, but I’ll track him down after this.

Thank you for visiting.

Stephanie Higginson: While they’re not in the House today, my family is celebrating two special birthdays today. As we all know, this job takes us away from the ability to do that, so I’m hoping that the members can help me wish a very happy birthday to two people who are special to me.

One is my stepdad, Len Manuel, who has been the coach extraordinaire of my children through all of their sporting careers, as well as one of the best campaign volunteers. I didn’t know he had it in him, but boy, did he show up. Happy 74th to my stepdad, Len.

[10:10 a.m.]

My son’s bestie, Basil Wells, is just about the best 14-year-old kid you could possibly hope would be involved in your kid’s life. Basil, I am so happy that you are in my life, and I am so happy for your youthful and wise influence. Happy 14th birthday to Basil Wells.

Could the House help me make them feel special on their birthdays.

Jeremy Valeriote: I’m happy to welcome West Vancouver constituents Jennifer and Frank Azizi. Jennifer has been a tireless advocate for companion animals, SPCA oversight and a review of the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals Act. They are here to see a petition delivered on this issue.

Welcome, Jennifer and Frank.

Amna Shah: Today we have a very special guest in the gallery, our super administrator, super coordinator and the Deputy Speaker’s assistant as well. We have Teresa Scambler.

Will the House join me in making her feel very welcome.

Hon. Josie Osborne: To complement the introduction that the Leader of the Third Party just provided, I want to welcome constituents from my home of Mid Island–Pacific Rim, Gary Gibson and Kathy Gibson from Port Alberni, who are joining Jennifer and Frank Azizi to witness my presentation of a petition that they have worked long and hard on with respect to the reform of dog laws. I really appreciate their advocacy, their hard work and their voices, and I look forward to presenting the petition.

Welcome to the Gibsons.

Introduction and
First Reading of Bills

Bill 9 — Health Care Costs
Recovery Amendment Act, 2025

Hon. Josie Osborne presented a message from Her Honour the Lieutenant Governor: a bill intituled Health Care Costs Recovery Amendment Act, 2025.

Hon. Josie Osborne: I move that the Health Care Costs Recovery Amendment Act, 2025, be introduced and read for a first time.

I am pleased to introduce this bill to amend the Health Care Costs Recovery Act. The Health Care Costs Recovery Act, first brought into force in 2009, supports a sustainable health care system by allowing the province to recover the costs of health care services provided to Medical Service Plan beneficiaries who have been injured or who have died due to the negligence of a wrongdoer. This ensures that the burden of paying for these costs falls on the wrongdoer and not taxpayers.

These amendments will address gaps that are currently preventing the province from recovering health care costs to the fullest extent possible. The amendments will narrow the circumstances in which the act does not apply because the beneficiary was injured in the course of their work, lengthen the window of time during which a claim can be amended to include a health services claim, expand disclosure obligations for defendants and their insurers, define who counts as an insurer under the act, clarify the effect of liability waivers, require that the province be notified when a third-party defendant is added to the legal proceedings and automatically include a health care cost claim against the third-party defendant when that happens, extend limitation periods to ensure the province has time to begin legal proceedings after being informed of a claim and allow prejudgment interest to be collected from defendants.

The Speaker: The question is the first reading of the bill.

Motion approved.

Hon. Josie Osborne: I move that Bill 9 be placed on the orders of the day for second reading at the next sitting of the House after today.

Motion approved.

Members’ Statements

Quesnel River Bridge Song

Sheldon Clare: I rise today to present a ditty that’s becoming, well, somewhat popular in the central Interior along Highway 97. If you’ll indulge me, sir.

[10:15 a.m.]

“Quesnel River Bridge is falling down, falling down, falling down,

Quesnel River Bridge is falling down, Mr. Premier.

Broken concrete, holes and girders, holes and girders, holes and girders,

Broken concrete, holes and girders, Mr. Premier.

Quesnel River Bridge is past its time, past its time, past its time.

Quesnel River Bridge is past its time, Mr. Premier.

Let us build the interconnector, interconnector, interconnector.

Let us build the interconnector, Mr. Premier.

Paint over rust carries no weight, carries no weight, carries no weight.

Paint over rust carries no weight, Mr. Premier.

Too narrow, too old and too much traffic, too much traffic, too much traffic.

Too narrow, too old and too much traffic, Mr. Premier.

See the concrete hit the water, hit the water, hit the water.

See the concrete hit the water, Mr. Premier.

See the rebar hit the rails, hit the rails, hit the rails.

See the rebar hit the rails, Mr. Premier.

People and province need the interconnector, need the interconnector, need the interconnector.

People and province need the interconnector, Mr. Premier.

You could call it the Farny bridge, the Farny bridge, the Farny bridge.

You could call it the Farny bridge or name it for Mr. Premier.

Taylor Bridge is just as bad, just as bad, just as bad.

Taylor Bridge is just as bad, Mr. Premier.

The Quesnel River Bridge is falling down, falling down, falling down.

The Quesnel River Bridge is falling down, thank you Mr. Speaker.”

Libraries and Library Workers

Rohini Arora: Well then.

Interjections.

Rohini Arora: No. No singing today.

Through the American Library Association, this week marks National Library Week, a time to recognize the vital role libraries and workers play in the fabric of our communities. Here in B.C., libraries like the Cameron Library in Burnaby East are more than just quiet buildings filled with books. They are living, breathing public institutions rooted in the values of equity, access and community care.

In this age of rampant misinformation and digital overwhelm, especially in the south, libraries stand as trusted beacons, helping people sort fact from fiction, navigate complex systems and find the truth in a time when that’s not always easy to do. They support newcomers learning English, parents attending early literacy groups, young kids and playtime, students tackling school projects and community members seeking help with job searches, housing forms and even financial literacy. Libraries are one of the few places left where you are not expected to spend money in order to belong.

And none of this would be possible without the library workers who make it happen. Librarians, many of whom are CUPE members, and library workers, who are represented by the BCGEU, are the ones who ensure these spaces remain welcoming, inclusive and accessible. They are educators, tech guides, storytime leaders and often the first point of contact for people needing guidance and facing isolation.

As we celebrate these workers this week, we must also fight alongside them for fair wages, job security and the respect their profession deserves, because strong libraries need strong, supported workers.

To every library worker: your work is not just appreciated; it is essential to a more informed, equitable and connected society.

Outhouse Races in
Cariboo-Chilcotin

Lorne Doerkson: To continue with another serious topic, members in this House are well aware of the primary use of an outhouse. But have you ever thought of them as a form of transportation or perhaps a racing vehicle?

Well, in Cariboo-Chilcotin we do exactly that. The outhouse races have been a late winter tradition in the Interlakes area for many years. Sponsored and organized by the Fishing Hwy 24 Tourist Association this year, 14 teams competed for first place. Of course, it’s quite an honour to have the fastest team or the most beautiful outhouse in Cariboo-Chilcotin.

On February 19, we found the grounds of the Iron Horse Pub in Lone Butte filled with hundreds of spectators and competitors. Residents were treated to amazing food by the Iron Horse. Also, the Peter Skene Ogden grad class of 2025 was serving up some amazing food as a fundraiser as well.

[10:20 a.m.]

The racing outhouses, decorated from top to bottom by the competitors, along with costumes ranging from princesses and Purex rolls to a very large T. Rex, were a pleasure.

Judging the prettiest outhouse — not an easy task. The winner? The Interlakes fire department with their entry, Fire in the Hole. A close second was the team from emergency services in 100 Mile House. The fastest in the women’s category, the Wettstone Ranch; second, Fire in the Hole. Men’s fastest was the RONA Young-uns; men’s second was T-Bowl. The real winners? The residents of Cariboo-Chilcotin.

Congratulations to all the racers and the volunteers who made this a great day of competition and laughs.

Anyone can enter this prestigious contest. It strikes me that this is an event that this Legislature could truly get behind, and I would encourage a team of presiding officers, Clerks, maybe even the Tourism Minister, to join us in the Cariboo.

I guarantee you won’t have more fun than at the outhouse races in the South Cariboo and Cariboo-Chilcotin.

Support for Port Industry

George Anderson: British Columbia has a choice: we can lead, or we can be left behind. A port strategy is key to our economic future because our ports don’t just connect us to the world; they connect B.C. businesses to new markets and create good jobs here at home. Canada’s ports generate over $53 billion in economic output. In B.C., the industrial marine sector contributes nearly $7 billion annually to our economy.

Last week, on behalf of the Minister of Transportation and Transit and as Parliamentary Secretary for Transit, I attended a groundbreaking for the Duke Point expansion at the Port of Nanaimo with DP World and Snuneymuxw First Nations.

Through our ports, forestry products from our mills supply builders in South Korea, seafood from our waters fills tables in Japan, and clean energy technology from B.C. powers projects in Europe. Yet sometimes it appears easier to ship across the Pacific than across Canada. That’s why considering a short-sea shipping strategy or using ports like Nanaimo, looking at feasibility studies to address future B.C. port capacity needs and working with the federal government, in partnership with Indigenous communities to recognize their rightful place at the economic table, is essential.

A port strategy would allow us to ease congestion in Metro Vancouver and create the necessary redundancies for our supply chains, as we learned after the extreme weather events at the Coquihalla. Imagine a future where a company in Prince George can ship across Canada as easily as overseas, where young British Columbians are trained for high-paying, skilled jobs in port logistics and shipping. This is what our government is already doing, growing the economy to secure B.C.’s future on the economic stage and world stage.

Quebec already has a port strategy that diversifies their markets. So if B.C. is the gateway to the world, let’s act like it by working with our ports and our rail and doing what we can to ensure that we open markets across Canada and internationally. Because if B.C. gets this right, we won’t just win the next decade, but we will win the next century.

Contributions and Work of Farmers

Heather Maahs: We are so blessed in the Fraser Valley to be a farming community. Farmers are the salt of the earth. They carry the burden of the community, the province, the country and the world on their shoulders. They work hard. They work the land, cultivating, planting, fertilizing, watering, harvesting.

Farmers are at the mercy of the weather. Nature answers to no man. The crops need to be tended. Machinery needs to be repaired. It’s a never-ending cycle. There’s no such thing as a day off. When we had the terrible flood a few years ago, farmers, friends, neighbours were out in boats trying to rescue livestock, taking whatever they could to higher ground. Sadly, much was lost in spite of their best efforts, including many of their homes.

We owe much to farmers, not just for what they provide us but also for their commitment, hard work and sacrifices. Farmers know and teach their families what hard work looks like, because it is, quite simply, just what they do every day. The heartbreak when a predator takes down their precious livestock or an infestation ruins a crop, but then comes the joy of spring, with the cycle of rebirth beginning again.

[10:25 a.m.]

In the words of the prolific Paul Harvey:

“God said, ‘I need somebody who will plow deep and straight and not cut corners; somebody to seed, weed, feed, breed and rake and disk and plow and plant, and tie the fleece, and strain the milk, and replenish the self-feeder, and finish a hard week’s work with a five-mile drive to church; somebody who would bale a family together with the soft, strong bonds of sharing, who would laugh and then sigh, and then reply, with smiling eyes, when his son says that he wants to spend his life doing what Dad does.’ So God made a farmer, and we are grateful he did.”

KidSport North Shore

Susie Chant: As always, I would like to begin by acknowledging that I work and live on the traditional and unceded territories of the xʷməθkʷəy̓əm, Sḵwx̱wú7mesh and səlilwətaɬ peoples. When I’m working and living in Victoria, I acknowledge the lək̓ʷəŋən peoples, specifically the Songhees and the Kosampson, who have lived here and stewarded these lands and waters since time immemorial.

Today, I would like to recognize a fantastic local non-profit organization that provides funding to families facing financial challenges so that their kids can also participate in sports. KidSport North Shore provides the money to cover registration fees and related costs so that all kids, ages five through 18, living on the north shore, can play in a season of their sport.

They provide grants of up to $600 per child per year, funding which supports full participation, including uniforms. KidSport North Shore also covers registration fees for disabled sports, such as Adaptive Snow Sports, which is skiing; Blind Sports; Deaf Sports; Wheelchair Sports; SportAbility; and Special Olympics. They have supported and sponsored four disabled youth athletes and provided over $2,000 in grants.

Since 2020, KidSport has quadrupled the number of kids they support, and have grown their financial support by a whopping 1,000 percent. This herculean effort is down to the enthusiastic and energetic volunteers that I had the chance to meet this past Saturday.

I attended the KidSport annual new and used equipment sale. I’m happy to report it was a massive success and will undoubtedly help many, many kids and their families. An entire high school gym was filled with tables, in turn, filled with gear for all the sports you could think of, for kids to be part of. Everything was laid out so it could be seen, tried on and purchased for a reasonable cost.

Thank you to KidSport North Shore, provincial and municipal governments, as well as the great corporate sponsors, who share their belief that the power of sport transforms lives.

Speaker’s Statement

Guidelines for Members
on Private Members’ Time

The Speaker: Hon. Members, before we continue with this morning’s proceedings, the Chair would like to provide guidance to members with respect to their responsibilities in ensuring that appropriate timelines are met to enable second reading debate of private members’ bills during private members’ time on a Monday morning. The Chair is aware that the practices for Monday mornings, as of the current parliament, are still new, and this guidance is intended to better serve the House and all members as we navigate this new reality.

As members are aware, a private member’s bill requires two days’ notice before it can be introduced and read a first time. After introduction and first reading, sufficient time must also be provided to work with the Law Clerk and Parliamentary Counsel to finalize the bill before it is authorized to be printed and distributed and therefore noted as printed on the order paper.

The length of time required is dependent on the bill’s readiness at introduction and often on whether the member has received appropriate advice on the propriety of the bill during the drafting process. Generally, bills that are introduced in good form are printed within two or three business days of introduction.

[10:30 a.m.]

The Chair will also note that should a situation arise where a member is first on the list of precedence for private members’ business and they do not have an eligible item of business on the order paper, such as a bill showing as “not printed,” the member would be removed from the list of precedence for the remainder of the parliament, or until such time as the list may be re-established.

The House would then proceed to the next member on the list of precedence to advance their item of business, as provided in Standing Order 27(4) .

The Chair has seen bills introduced only one or two sitting days in advance after anticipated second reading debate, putting their eligibility to proceed at risk.

With these requirements in mind, it is incumbent upon members to ensure that sufficient time has been provided to finalize and print their bill before they anticipate moving second reading during private members’ time.

Members are also reminded that they may have more than one item of business on the order paper, whether it be a private member’s bill or a notice of motion. Although private members’ motions also require two days’ notice, they would be eligible to be called for debate as soon as they are listed on the order paper, providing another option for private members to bring their business forward.

Additional guidance is provided in the Private Members’ Time booklet that has been provided to all members, and procedural support and advice is available from the Chair, the Table Officers and the Office of the Clerk.

I trust all private members will be mindful of these reminders as they prepare for private members’ time.

Oral Questions

Budget Deficit and
Government Financial Management

John Rustad: The Premier has been in power since 2022. Over that period of time, which was less than three years, we’ve gone from a $6 billion surplus to a $14 billion deficit. It’s a $20 billion shift with nothing to show for it except for four credit downgrades.

Two of those downgrades came in a single day just last week. It’s unprecedented. The downgrade from Moody’s highlights a very serious issue about transparency and accountability with this government’s fudge-it budget.

To the Premier: please explain to this House exactly how this government will make up the $3 billion of lost revenue in their fudge-it budget.

Hon. Brenda Bailey: Thank you to the member opposite for the question.

This budget is focused on three primary things. First, protecting core services for British Columbians. It’s also deeply focused on ensuring that every dollar that we are entrusted with from British Columbians is well spent. That’s why we’re doing an efficiency review. That work is ongoing, and we’ll report out on it on Q1. It’s also focused on revenue growth. These things must happen in concert.

We are going to move things to a balanced budget. It’s going to happen over time, over multiple budgets.

The Speaker: Member, supplemental.

John Rustad: Well, it’s interesting. We are in the process of budget estimates, and all of our members in the opposition are working very hard to make sure that we are prepared, asking questions about how that money is being spent.

The question really is: when you’ve got that big a hole in the budget, when you’re off by that much, how on earth can we be efficiently being able to do our job when we have no idea whether there’s going to be cuts or whether there’s going to be changes? A $3 billion deficit — this is nothing trivial in terms of what’s happening in British Columbia.

This government knew in advance that they were going to get rid of the carbon tax. They campaigned on it. It should not have been a surprise.

Can the Finance Minister confirm that nobody in her ministry actually thought out a plan as to how to deal with this? Or, quite frankly, was this just pure incompetence or an intentional fudge-it budget?

Hon. Brenda Bailey: Our budget was tabled in accordance with legislative requirements and prepared with the information available and government decisions at the time. A budget is a moment in time, and it is not appropriate to include speculative things in a budget. We had to wait until the action had been taken by the federal government.

[10:35 a.m.]

We made it very clear. The Premier was very clear on this. He said: “When and if the federal government removes the backstops on the carbon tax, B.C. will do the same thing.”

The budget was tabled on March 4. At that time, the federal government still had the carbon tax in place. On March 14, that change was made. The first day that we were back in this chamber, we moved forward with the change, in accordance to the commitment we made to British Columbians.

Á’a:líya Warbus: On Thursday, April 3, a question was raised by opposition regarding Moody’s projection that the province’s deficit would balloon to $14.3 billion. The minister’s response: “The member opposite can make up numbers all he wants.”

The numbers were not made up. Moody’s stated that their projected deficit of $14.3 billion was due to: “Our projections include the adverse revenue impacts of the province’s recent decision and legislative change to eliminate the consumer carbon tax.”

I’d like to offer the minister an opportunity to retract her statement that the opposition was making up numbers about her fudge-it budget. Will the minister retract her statement and acknowledge that Moody’s projected this government to accumulate a $14.3 billion deficit?

Hon. Brenda Bailey: There are many things that go into a decision by these credit rating agencies, including very important factors like the threat of tariffs and now the implementation of tariffs that we’re experiencing.

Interjections.

The Speaker: Shhh, Members.

Hon. Brenda Bailey: This is a time of extreme economic uncertainty. We do expect that many, many provinces….

Interjections.

The Speaker: Members. Members.

Members, let the minister continue.

Hon. Brenda Bailey: We do expect that many provinces, unfortunately, will experience credit rating downturn.

I will highlight a number of other things that these credit agencies have said about us, because there are many things going in our favour.

First of all, Moody’s notes that B.C.’s credit profile is supported by a resilient and diverse economy, with lower reliance on the U.S. than other provinces. S&P also highlights that federal immigration policies and heightened trade uncertainty will create challenges for economic growth.

There are many factors that go into these decisions. But what’s important for British Columbians to know is that British Columbia has what the world wants, and we will continue to diversify our economy, to bring down trade barriers and to ensure economic growth to support what’s important to British Columbians.

The Speaker: Member, supplemental.

Á’a:líya Warbus: Accountability matters, transparency matters, and this government has already been called the most secretive government in Canada, quoted by the B.C. Freedom of Information and Privacy Association.

This opposition works very hard to dig into numbers, hold the government to account. But when we can’t get accurate information, it’s downright irresponsible.

Again, will the minister do the right thing, pause the Committee of Supply or, at the very least, admit in the House and to the people of British Columbia that the new deficit that we’re facing down is, in fact, $14.3 billion.

Hon. Brenda Bailey: What I would say to the member opposite is that I very much do respect the work of the opposition. Absolutely.

It is absolutely normal procedure that a budget will be brought in and that it is a reflection of a moment in time. The normal way of things is that any changes will be reflected at Q1, and changes that come next will be reflected at Q2. This is the normal way of things.

We’re doing tremendous work right now on the question of our deficit.

Interjections.

The Speaker: Members. Members.

Members, wait for your turn.

[10:40 a.m.]

Hon. Brenda Bailey: We are doing important work right now on the question of deficit, and I am determined to get us back on the road to balance. That work is going on now. We’ll have more to show at Q1, which is the normal way of things.

Fuel Costs and Role
of B.C. Utilities Commission

Jeremy Valeriote: The carbon tax is no more, and gas prices have actually dropped across B.C. But despite the Premier’s warning to the industry, whether these prices will last is far from certain. How much oil and gas companies stand to profit from this abrupt change is yet to be seen.

The 2019 Fuel Price Transparency Act requires companies to submit data, but it also needs to carry consequences when consumers are being gouged. In the Sea to Sky for years, residents have been paying the same or higher price for fuel, despite a 12-cent-per-litre differential from the TransLink levy that they don’t have to pay. So the FPTA has not benefited my constituents, despite the BCUC’s data confirming that Sea to Sky drivers have been overcharged for years.

If kitchen table affordability is really this government’s focus, my question for the minister is: when will you give the BCUC some teeth so it can take a bite out of blatant profiteering by oil and gas companies?

Hon. Adrian Dix: This Legislature did pass the Fuel Price Transparency Act in 2019, and that act has had a very significant effect — that transparency and, frankly, the work of a lot of people, including independent organizations — in ensuring that differentials between fuel price in British Columbia and other provinces are not there. In fact, the extent of that differential has been reduced by 62 percent, which shows the value in this case of the legislation that we passed unanimously in this Legislature.

There will be a continuing task, particularly in this time when affordability is important for people. We have to ensure that the full value of the carbon tax cut goes to consumers. There will be, of course, important activity done by the BCUC in support of that.

The member might well argue —and he, presumably, is arguing — for full regulation of prices in B.C., but our act is based on transparency. It’s working very effectively. I think it’s acknowledged to be working effectively, and we have to continue to support the BCUC in its work.

The Speaker: Member, supplemental.

Jeremy Valeriote: So while carbon taxes became a scapegoat during the inflation crisis, oil companies were actually the biggest driver of rising costs. A recent report for the Centre for Future Work shows how oil companies pocketed $151 billion during the fossil fuel spike of 2022, costing Canadian households an average of $12,000 each. The report warns that without action, B.C. remains vulnerable to future price spikes.

The best protection against oil price spikes is to transition away from fossil fuels, and the Green caucus will continue to push in this direction. In the meantime, to the Minister of Energy: what will the province do to protect British Columbians and tax windfall profits appropriately to help cover some of these budget deficits?

Hon. Adrian Dix: A couple of things. First of all, I would note that the impact of the Fuel Price Transparency Act, the fact that transparency led to a reduction in prices, should not be a moment of great pride for the industry. I’d say that.

With respect to what we need to do, what we need to do is to build more clean energy. I think the member would agree with that. That is exactly what we’re doing: clean energy the size of Site C in projects supported by the government, all of them amongst our 18 priority projects; wind and solar projects that are lower-priced and will serve British Columbia for a generation and displace, when we do that, often energy resources that have to come from elsewhere.

They’re good for the economy for that reason. They’re good for communities. They’re good for regions, particularly in the interior of the province. And we’ve got to continue to do it. Our response to this must be to lean in to building more electricity so consumers and everyone else can have more options.

Budget Provisions for
Food Security and Farmers

Ian Paton: I recently spent four hours in Agriculture and Food estimates reviewing programs meant to support food security and farmers across this province.

Is the minister cutting these vital programs, or are billions being added in debt to their fudge-it budget?

[10:45 a.m.]

Hon. Lana Popham: I appreciate the question from the member, and we did enjoy four hours together. Maybe it was five. It was so fun I lost track of time. We always have a great debate, and the one thing I know about the member is that he loves agriculture as much as I do.

I think everybody in British Columbia, everybody in Canada, understands the importance of food security, food resiliency and the food economy, especially now, since we’ve been under a lot of pressure because of the tariffs. It’s really an important issue to our farmers here in British Columbia.

We know how important food security is on this side of the House, and I imagine the other side does as well. That’s why we’ve increased our ministry budget from $130 million to $143 million.

Budget Provisions for Tourism

Gavin Dew: I’m confused. During estimates for Tourism, Arts, Culture and Sport, we spent four hours asking the minister questions in good faith about key programs that should be strengthening our communities and supporting private sector jobs. Now, I don’t know if we were debating real numbers or a fudge-it budget.

So which is it? Would the minister please stand up and let us know whether we’re cutting tourism funding or is the province increasing the deficit?

Hon. Spencer Chandra Herbert: I’m just so excited about the future for our province because tourism is in every one of our communities. Tourism provides incredible jobs for over 127,000 British Columbians. It’s actually Tourism Week in B.C. I say Tourism Week, tourism month, tourism year, because we have so much opportunities to support our communities.

I’m glad the member asked questions in estimates. I’m sorry the critic was unable to join us. I send her my best wishes. But I’ve just got to say the future is bright for tourism. I’m keen that we’re supporting it. I’m keen we’re investing in it, in communities all across this province, and I’m looking forward to continuing to support our tourism industry. I wish the others would get on board.

Budget Provisions
for FIFA World Cup

Mandeep Dhaliwal: In Tourism estimates, I asked about the FIFA World Cup. Was the minister using real or made-up fudge-it budget numbers during this debate?

Hon. Spencer Chandra Herbert: I’m glad the member asked about the World Cup. It’s coming next year. It’s exciting for B.C. The opportunity is huge. It’s huge.

I know not everybody on that side maybe supports soccer, but I do know some of the members were asking me for tickets. I don’t have any tickets to give you, members. You’ll have to buy them like the general public when they become available.

But the World Cup has got an opportunity…

Interjections.

The Speaker: Members.

Hon. Spencer Chandra Herbert: …to grow our economy by over $1 billion.

The members have a lot to say, but they don’t actually say very much. It’s unfortunate. It is called question period. They asked a question. The member asked a question, and I’m keen to share why we’re supporting the World Cup.

[The Speaker rose.]

The Speaker: When will members learn not to interrupt others when one person is speaking? Please.

Is the Minister done?

[The Speaker resumed their seat.]

Hon. Spencer Chandra Herbert: Thank you. I’d just say the World Cup is coming to B.C. We’re excited about it. It’s unfortunate the Conservatives aren’t.

Budget Provisions
for Infrastructure Projects

Misty Van Popta: B.C.’s infrastructure is crumbling, and this government just blew a $3 billion hole in their fudge-it budget. Will this minister tell us what priority infrastructure projects will get delayed or cancelled due to their fudge-it budget?

The Speaker: Minister of Transportation.

Hon. Mike Farnworth: Thank you, hon. Speaker.

Interjection

The Speaker: Member, for God’s sake. This is really getting out of control.

Hon. Mike Farnworth: It’s okay, hon. Speaker. I will remind him of the words, which are that the B.C. Conservatives are falling down.

Because this side of the House, $15 billion worth of infrastructure projects being built right across this province…. From a $5.9 billion Surrey-Langley SkyTrain, from Highway 1 widening….

Interjection.

[10:50 a.m.]

Hon. Mike Farnworth: Not infrastructure? A member on the other side says building a SkyTrain is not building infrastructure? That building a Pattullo Bridge is not building infrastructure? That widening of Highway 1 isn’t building infrastructure? The rebuilding of Hazel Trembath School in my riding is not infrastructure? Clearly, they need to stay on that side for a very long time to come.

Budget Provisions for
Emergency Response and Recovery

Macklin McCall: Wildfires, floods and other disasters are significant in B.C., and this NDP government has failed to deal with the impact. After four hours of questioning, we still don’t know if their fudge-it budget is accurate.

How much worse will this government’s response be when they cut essential services?

Hon. Kelly Greene: We know that communities across B.C. are finding increasing effects from climate change. It’s definitely top of mind for our ministry to make sure that communities are well-supported in both the preparation before events happen and then also in recovery.

To date, we spent over $500 million on 2,500 projects to get communities prepared and ready for events. We’re going to continue doing this work. It’s vitally important to partner with local communities and First Nations.

Budget Provisions
for Energy and Climate Solutions

Hon Chan: In 2018, this NDP government removed the requirement for B.C. to be energy self-sufficient.

We are about to go into a nine-hour estimates for the Ministry of Energy. How can we possibly debate the estimates of this fudge-it budget when we don’t even have the accurate numbers?

Hon. Adrian Dix: The member will know that with respect to energy self-sufficiency and energy projects, B.C. Hydro routinely submits all of that information to the B.C. Utilities Commission for review. I’d suggest he look there.

In addition to that, we do need — I’d agree with everyone — more energy in B.C. I am surprised that when we are saying we need to build projects — and we’re building projects — the opposition opposes them. I am surprised.

Interjections.

The Speaker: Shhh, shhh.

Hon. Adrian Dix: Oh, there they go again.

Interjections.

The Speaker: Members.

Minister will continue.

Hon. Adrian Dix: In British Columbia, we need to build more electricity, more clean electricity, more renewable electricity. That’s precisely what we’re doing.

B.C. Hydro has a $36 billion capital plan that addresses issues of infrastructure and building out our province. We are going to aspire to be the clean energy super power we need. We have to continue to do this.

All of the information relevant to that debate is available to the opposition, as are briefings from my ministry, which will be provided to the opposition.

So I think there are bigger issues in B.C. than how sad the opposition is about estimates. There are issues about affordability that people are facing. There’s a response to the Donald Trump tariffs. There are significant issues across British Columbia.

Interjections.

The Speaker: Shhh.

Hon. Adrian Dix: I think if the opposition needs more information….

Interjections.

Hon. Adrian Dix: There they go, they’re just yelling. But if the opposition needs more information, they know that we’ll provide that information.

Starlink Satellite Internet
Service Contract

Rosalyn Bird: Last Thursday I arose in Citizens’ Services estimates to discuss how this government approaches information management and recordkeeping. It was interesting to confirm during estimates that this government has signed a contract worth over $5 million with Elon Musk’s Starlink to provide high-speed broadband services to rural communities.

Is the $5 million contract cancelled, or is it still part of the fudge-it budget?

[10:55 a.m.]

Hon. George Chow: Yes, I can confirm that the contract is still in force. These contracts are for the safety and well-being of British Columbians. We are not going to cancel things like remote highway cameras or connectivity at remote highway stations. We'll continue to work, doing what we have been doing, trying to connect the province by 2027.

We have invested $584 million in connectivity since coming to form government in 2017, and we have moved the dial significantly. In 2017, rural homes connectivity rate was only 57 percent. Now it’s 74 percent.

For First Nations communities, particularly, in 2017, was 66 percent. Now they're 83 percent connected. By the completion of this project in 2027, they will be connected to the rate of 96 percent.

So we are very confident that the project is ongoing and that in the future…

The Speaker: Thank you, Minister.

Hon. George Chow: …there will be more options for services which will benefit consumers.

The Speaker: Thank you, Minister.

Hon. George Chow: So I answered your question, Member.

Budget Provisions for
Education and Child Care

Lynne Block: My fellow MLA and I spent six hours in education estimates questioning the Minister of Education and Child Care about their priorities.

Will this minister have to cut vital education programs to try and balance their fudge-it budget?

Hon. Lisa Beare: What I can do is confirm that we are spending more money than we ever have before in education. We, in our government, are doing everything we can to set our kids up for success.

We are continuing to protect core services like education in light of uncertain times, including Trump tariffs. We are investing an additional $370 million in education this year to do some amazing things.

I am going to highlight a couple of them. We have invested $30 million to improve literacy for all students and an additional $20 million to boost the student and family affordability fund, which helps pay for student necessities like school supplies.

We are expanding our food program, with almost 90 percent of our schools in B.C. now offering school food programs. That's $214 million, because we know a child who is hungry can't learn to their best ability.

We are going to continue to invest in our kids. I get the honour of doing that now from birth to graduation. We are going to keep supporting them.

Budget Provisions for
Post-Secondary and
Future Skills Programs

Korky Neufeld: Well, British Columbia is facing a $14.3 billion projected deficit and growing, so students, institutions and training programs deserve clarity. Can the minister confirm whether Post-Secondary and Future Skills funding can expect cuts?

Hon. Anne Kang: Thank you so much to the member across for that question.

Yesterday, in estimates, I did confirm that there were extra investments in Post-Secondary Education and Future Skills. In fact, since 2017, our government has increased operating funding to post-secondary institutions every year and provided over $1 billion in additional grants between 2017 to 2025.

I want to take this opportunity to really thank our public post-secondary institutions for working with our industries and with our partners to make sure that we are providing the best quality education for the workers of our future.

Budget Provisions for
Mental Health and Addictions Services

Claire Rattée: I spent eight hours questioning the Minister of Health during estimates focusing on mental health and addictions, a crisis perpetuated by failed NDP policies.

[11:00 a.m.]

Given the government's projected $14.3 billion fudge-it budget, can the minister confirm whether her ministry will cut programs? Yes or no?

Hon. Josie Osborne: B.C. has a growing population, an aging population. We know, more than ever, that it is important to ensure that we strengthen B.C.’s public health care system so that we know that that health care is there for people when and where they need it. As the members all know, the Health Ministry has a $4.2 billion lift over the next three years to continue those critical investments.

The opposition is asking about cuts, and I’m going to talk about what we’re not cutting and what we’re not saying no to. On this side of the House, we’re not saying no to a new medical school training doctors here. We’re not saying no to a piece of land for a new Surrey hospital. We are not ripping up contracts for essential health care workers as part of our health care system.

At this rate, I’d expect that they would ask us to cancel the review of the health authorities, but we’re moving ahead on those, because we know it’s important to minimize unnecessary administrative spending. We’re going to make sure that dollars are being maximized on the front line, delivering health care services for British Columbians.

Budget Projections and Priorities

Peter Milobar: “Given the evolving and fluid situation, implementation of U.S. tariffs and Canada’s response are not incorporated into the Budget 2025 economic outlook.” That’s a direct quote from page 3 of this Finance Minister’s fudge-it budget.

We’ve had questions now to ten different ministers today. Not one can point to any specific potential cost savings or not in this year’s fudge-it budget. In fact, the Minister of Finance refuses to acknowledge whether that means the deficit is going up or not. It’s actually a pretty straightforward question that the opposition is trying to get to the bottom of.

The minister can deflect and talk about first-quarter updates all she would like. That’s not until September 15. That’s when the first-quarter update will actually come out. I would point out that the carbon tax was actually brought in and implemented and the repeal happened before we even dealt with other tax measures in this year’s budget.

So for the Minister of Finance to try to deflect and say she cannot accurately say what is going to happen to $3 billion worth of revenue — whether it will be direct service cuts in the immediate time or whether it gets directly added to our deficit while we’re facing credit downgrades predicated on that — is completely irresponsible by this minister and by this government.

The Energy Minister talks….

The Speaker: Question, Member.

Peter Milobar: Perhaps he could give advice on how to backdate budget documents to this minister so we could get some accurate numbers.

The Speaker: Question, Member.

Peter Milobar: When will we have an accurate representation of what is happening to the revenues and expenses in this province?

Hon. Brenda Bailey: Thank you to the member for the question.

A budget is a moment in time. It is. It’s a moment in time.

Interjections.

The Speaker: Shhh.

Hon. Brenda Bailey: It incorporates the information available at that time. At the time that we were preparing our budget, there was tremendous uncertainty about which tariffs were coming in, when and how. We made assumptions based on the information that we had.

Interjections.

The Speaker: Let her finish, Members.

Hon. Brenda Bailey: We did include the disruption to the economy that was already happening, that will continue to happen.

Interjections.

The Speaker: Members. Let the minister finish.

Hon. Brenda Bailey: It’s not appropriate to include decisions that have not yet been made in our budget assumptions. The question about the carbon tax…. Yes, it came in on March 14. It could just as well have happened in December or the following year.

We have to make assumptions to do budgeting, and that’s what we did. They’re defensible. They’re appropriate. They’re the normal way of things. I look forward to going through estimates with the member opposite. But there’s nothing unusual to how we introduced this budget. And of course, the uncertainty that we’re facing right now due to tariffs….

[11:05 a.m.]

Interjection.

The Speaker: Member.

Hon. Brenda Bailey: But I will point out that on this side of the House, we're taking these economic threats deeply seriously, and we're standing up at every opportunity we have to Trump, as opposed to the other side of the House.

[End of question period.]

Point of Order

Gavin Dew: Mr. Speaker, during debate, I noted that the Minister of State for Trade used unparliamentary language. Given how little he has risen in this House to actually talk about trade in the middle of a trade war, I would invite him to stand and withdraw that language.

The Speaker: Is the minister of state willing to respond? If not, the Chair will review the Hansard recordings.

Tabling Documents

The Speaker: Hon. Members, I have the honour to table the Human Rights Commissioner's report “We Are Still Here,” a report of the inquiry into detention under the Adult Guardianship Act.

Question of Privilege
(Reservation of Right)

Hon. Brenda Bailey: The member opposite has raised a question of privilege, which I would like to respond to this afternoon, before the House rises.

Petitions

Hon. Josie Osborne: I have the honour of presenting a petition to the assembly.

Approximately 3,000 people across British Columbia are requesting to reform B.C. dog laws, stopping arbitrary seizures, euthanasia and providing access to justice.

The petitioners request that this House reviews and amends section 49 of the Community Charter and related legislation to provide transparency, accountability, oversight, clarity, humane reforms and fairness to dogs, guardians and the public and to recognize that a dog's best interests are worthy of consideration in all aspects.

Orders of the Day

Hon. Mike Farnworth: In this chamber, I call continued estimates debate for the Ministry of Health.

In the Douglas Fir Room, Section A, I call continued estimates debate for the Ministry of Post-Secondary Education and Future Skills.

[Mable Elmore in the chair.]

[11:10 a.m.]

Estimates: Ministry of Health
(continued)

On Vote 32: ministry operations, $34,996,928,000 (continued).

Claire Rattée: Thank you to the minister for finally providing that breakdown of publicly-funded beds. I appreciate it. I will note that it arrived at the very end of my time, so it’s going to be difficult to ask the follow-up questions that this information demands. I’m going to try and be brief by working a fair bit of it into one question, if that’s okay.

According to the document, there are 2,189 publicly-funded beds across the province. But when I dig into that number, only 806 of those are bed-based treatment beds, which your own health authority websites describe as structured, live-in treatment programs providing intensive, evidence-based therapy and support in a substance-free environment. I would wonder if the minister agrees that this is the most appropriate definition of treatment in the clinical sense, because I certainly would, and that was the number that I was looking for.

That means that only 36 percent of what the government counts as treatment beds are actually providing structured, clinical, evidence-based treatment. The other beds, 752 in total, are what the health authorities define as supportive recovery beds. These do not offer clinical programming or therapy but are rather low- to moderate-intensity communal living arrangements offering peer support.

I would also wonder why the ministry is conflating supportive recovery with treatment, in its reporting. I have to wonder if that isn’t just to make the numbers appear a little bit higher.

Of those 806 actual treatment beds, the regional disparities are striking. Fraser Health has 172. Interior Health has 123. Vancouver Coastal has 102. Island Health has 147. PHSA has 311. But Northern Health, which covers 15 percent of the population, including 32 communities, 55 of B.C.’s 203 First Nations, or more than a quarter of them, and a landmass the size of entire countries has only seven treatment beds.

I would also wonder if the minister genuinely believes that this is an equitable distribution of treatment resources.

[11:15 a.m.]

To put this in a global perspective, Northern Health spans an area that is equivalent to countries like Ukraine or South Sudan and twice the size of countries such as Italy or the Philippines, and yet it receives just 0.8 percent of the province’s bed-based treatment capacity.

Given the overdose death rate in Indigenous communities in the North is six times the provincial average, I would like to know how the ministry can justify allocating seven treatment beds to a region with such immense need.

Would the minister also agree with the previous statements I have made in the House that access to detox services without immediate follow-up access to structured treatment is for many people a death sentence? We have people cycling through withdrawal, stabilization and then back into the toxic drug supply because there is no next step.

I would like to know what the ministry is doing to close that fatal gap and better understand why these numbers are reported the way that they are and why we only actually have seven treatment beds in Northern Health.

[11:20 a.m.]

Hon. Josie Osborne: Thank you to the member for the question.

I want to, first off, acknowledge two things that the member raised, two really important things. One is around equity for access to services for people living in the North, for people living in rural and remote areas. And the second is around the profoundly disproportionate impact that the toxic drug crisis is having on Indigenous peoples.

I want to acknowledge that, yes, it is inequitable to see that there are fewer treatment beds available to people living in the North and that there is work to do to build more services in the North. It’s very important that people have access to care as close to home as possible, and being able to do that in a way where barriers like travel distances and being away from community and friends and family and loved ones is an important part of that. That’s why we have to continue to invest in the North.

I’m going to talk a little bit more about that in a moment, but I also want to talk about the importance of supportive recovery beds. The member speaks to the difference between treatment and supportive recovery and the importance — and I agree — of not letting people fall through the gaps when moving from detox or withdrawal management, for example, into a treatment bed and then into supportive recovery.

That supportive recovery provides an important service for people, in a safe living environment, where access to supports and training like life skills training and psychosocial programming is important and people who are living in supportive recovery facilities or dwellings also can still be undergoing treatment. They are still accessing things like OAT, and that’s an important part of a supportive recovery centre as well.

[11:25 a.m.]

With respect to continued investments, I want to just go back to remarks I made in response to a question a few days ago or last week around the expansion of Road to Recovery and the priority that the northwest of British Columbia has in expanding the Road to Recovery. There are new dollars in this year’s budget to do that. The Road to Recovery is, again, providing that access into a seamless continuum of care in enabling people to move from withdrawal management into treatment, into supportive recovery.

I also want to point to the recently opened Connective therapeutic recovery centre, in Prince George — 25 beds that have just opened and so perhaps not captured in the figures that the member received from last year — and then talk about the importance of Indigenous-led care as well.

As the member remarked, the disproportionate impact on Indigenous populations, on Indigenous peoples, means we have to continue the focus on partnership with First Nations and enabling and truly supporting Indigenous-led solutions — our work with the First Nations Health Authority, for example, in an Indigenous treatment centre, which Carrier Sekani Family Services is proposing and will be developing.

It’s currently in the construction phase. The target completion is summer 2026, with the possibility of being opened a little bit earlier than that, with 36 treatment and supportive recovery beds and ten withdrawal management beds, for a total of 46 beds, all in one facility. Now, that partnership is the result of the federal government and the provincial government supporting the First Nations Health Authority to bring that centre about.

Then lastly, I’ll just point to the work with the Northern First Nations Alliance in establishing community-based and culturally safe treatment. I know we canvassed that in a previous question, but this is the type of investment and the type of work that needs to continue to happen in the North, to continue to bring this seamless system of treatment and care to people, who deserve to have access to that care, in a way that is close to home and that supports the unique lifestyles of people living in the North.

Claire Rattée: Respectfully, that’s really not going to help the problem that we’re facing up North right now. Again, we talked about the difference between the bed-based treatment beds and the supportive recovery beds. I can’t help but notice that in my riding, there are only these supportive recovery beds, which is not clinical, evidence-based, structured treatment, which is what people in my riding need. So that still doesn’t address that problem. It doesn’t address the problem that people are falling through the cracks consistently.

I just got news, about an hour ago, that my cousin-in-law, after leaving treatment, took his life last night. Where is the follow-through? How is this system working for people? That shouldn’t have happened. That is a common story.

There needs to be more done on this file. This is not good enough. It’s not cutting it for people in my riding. It’s not cutting it for people across this province, because my cousin-in-law was in Surrey. There’s not enough being done.

In the interest of time, I have also identified a number of beds on that list that are specifically designated for alcohol use disorder only, which is obviously a problem. But I would like the minister to tell me how many of those 806 bed-based treatment beds are alcohol-only and how many are accessible to individuals using opioids or stimulants or to other substance users.

We are in the midst right now of a toxic drug crisis, so I would hope that the minister agrees that we need to prioritize treatment that reflects the substances driving deaths, so those numbers could be detracted from that total number. I would welcome the minister to get back to me on that when she has the time.

My final question: will the minister commit to reporting bed-based treatment numbers separately and transparently, going forward, rather than lumping them in with supportive recovery and transitional beds that do not provide treatment in the clinical sense.

British Columbians deserve clarity, especially those trying to get help. When we tell people that there are 2,189 treatment beds, but only 806 of those are actually offering therapy and clinical support, it’s misleading the public, in my opinion.

I would like a response to that. Then afterwards, I will be giving the floor back to my colleague from Courtenay-Comox.

[11:30 a.m.]

Hon. Josie Osborne: First of all, I want to express my condolences to the member for Skeena. That is absolutely tragic news to hear about her cousin-in-law.

I think bringing the stories like this and the impact that it has on people to this House is a really important part of raising awareness and slowly making it easier for us to be able to talk about this but also building bridges of understanding so that we can work together on investing and on treatment for people, on meeting people where they’re at and doing everything we can together.

The full range of types of treatment, which are not limited to just bed-based treatment but are available through other ways — through clinical counselling, through opioid agonist therapies, through the work at supportive recovery centres and all of that…. Ensuring that the public has a good and better understanding, as the member I think is really driving at, is a really important thing.

I’d like to do two things. First of all, I want to offer the member for Skeena a full briefing on the mental health and substance use snapshot — a snapshot that comes out twice a year, I believe — and have her sit down with staff from my ministry and really seek her feedback on better ways to report that, to try to better answer some of the questions that she’s asking and, importantly, like the member points out, to ensure that the public has the fullest understanding of what is out there and what is happening and available for people.

The second thing I’d like to offer the member is a tour at the Road to Recovery centre at St. Paul’s hospital in downtown Vancouver and an opportunity to meet with program staff there and learn more and see firsthand what the Road to Recovery program is like and how the seamless system of care that’s being developed there is working for people there.

As I mentioned before, our intentions and our commitment, through the budget, is to expand this program into every single health authority, including up in the northwest where the member is from.

[11:35 a.m.]

Certainly for myself, visiting Road to Recovery, seeing that, talking to people, talking to staff there was a really important part of my understanding, and I, respectfully, would offer the member the same. So I’ll follow up with the member on this and some of the other questions I know that she is waiting for answers to from estimates.

Once again, I just thank her for the dialogue that we’ve had. I really appreciate this opportunity.

Brennan Day: In the interest of time here, I’ll just lay out what we’re going to be doing for the next four hours of our afternoon so that we can make sure we don’t waste any of the ministry’s time. We’re getting through about five to six questions an hour. I know these are very difficult questions, but I think British Columbians need to get these on the record.

What I’ll be doing is finishing up on rural health with the TAP program and then getting into a bit of BCEHS. In the interest of time, I will ask a couple of questions on each of those subjects and then read the remainder into the record so that we can follow them up later. I think they’re fairly straightforward questions, but I know that they might take some time to prepare. It would be fantastic if the minister could get back to us on those.

I’ll get started, but first I would like to just talk about a response from the ministry in yesterday’s period regarding the cancellation of U.S. cancer care. I don’t believe that question should have been taken on notice. That program had been cut during our conversation, and I assume that means that the ministry is confident that the current wait times in B.C. and the statistics that she cited to close that option to Canadians…. I would just like to get that on the record, and I hope that we do not see any life-altering delays in the access to that care going forward.

Moving on to the travel assistance program, or TAP, given 80 percent of rural residents report financial difficulty accessing care, why hasn’t the travel assistance program expanded to include accommodations or upfront payments to reduce the burden on British Columbians who are already struggling with overwhelming affordability issues?

The Premier promised a $5 million expansion. Where is that in this budget? Has it been budgeted? Is it under risk of cuts due to the cancellation of the carbon tax? What parameters determine that amount? How many trips does that $5 million represent to British Columbians who are struggling to access rural health care?

Rural British Columbians are dying to know, Minister.

[11:40 a.m.]

Hon. Josie Osborne: Thank you to the member for the question.

I appreciate the interest and support for people living in rural areas of British Columbia and helping to overcome some of the barriers that people face in accessing health care. Part of that, of course, is the barriers people face in terms of cost and time in travelling out for health-authority-related appointments, for cancer care and for other essential and often life-saving services.

The member speaks specifically around the travel assistance program, a program that is largely ferries-based. Just in case we have a misunderstanding between each other, this is not a program that requires reimbursement later. This is a program — of course, after the appropriate forms are filled by physicians — that enables people to travel on ferries at no charge, so no money is required up front. That is a barrier for people having to front-load those costs.

In December we expanded that program to cover…. I’ll call them inland ferries, or routes that are not publicly B.C. Ferries–run routes but routes that are still valuable travel between places like, in my own riding, Port Alberni and Bamfield, for example, supporting people and, again, ensuring that they do not have to pay the cost of that up front, because that is a barrier for people.

We have made platform commitments that we will be sticking to, over the course of our mandate as government, around expanding supports for people living in rural communities. I want to assure the member that that very much remains in place but also that there is a real plethora of different kinds of programs available for people. The health authorities each have websites that clearly lay out the different programs that people can access. I just want to briefly talk to some of them so that people understand what’s available out there.

[11:45 a.m.]

For example, Health Connections is a health-authority-based regional travel assistance program. This offers subsidized transportation options to people who have to obtain non-emergency, physician-referred medical care outside of their home communities.

For example, in Interior Health, there are bus services that link small communities with the tertiary and regional hospitals in all four health service areas. Island Health distributes funding to eight different contracted transportation providers, but a patient calls one number and gets access to one of those transportation providers to help assist them.

Vancouver Coastal Health, similarly, has established services in places like Bella Coola Valley, for example. Northern Health retains a contractor to provide low-cost bus transportation for patients who need out-of-town medical appointments in northern B.C. and in Vancouver.

The First Nations Health Authority. They also provide a medical transportation benefit, providing assistance with the cost of meals and accommodation and transportation to assist with that.

The BC family residence program provides accommodation assistance to enable families living outside Metro Van to stay together when their child requires medical care at B.C. Children's Hospital or Sunny Hill Health Centre for Children. This ensures that local transportation costs, meals, personal expenses…. Although those are the responsibility of the patient, this program provides accommodation assistance and helps families stay close by to their children.

The Ministry of Social Development and Poverty Reduction offers medical transportation supplements. The Ministry of Children and Family Development's At Home program provides medical benefits. The Ministry of Citizens’ Services maintains a courtesy listing of hotels in B.C. that provide discounted accommodation rates for people travelling away from home who are perhaps not able to access some of these other programs.

Incredibly importantly for people seeking treatment for cancer, the Canadian Cancer Society runs two programs to help cancer patients with medical travel: Wheels of Hope, which connects people who need transportation with volunteer drivers, and a travel treatment fund that provides short-term financial assistance to cover some of those costs. The Canadian Cancer Society received a $10 million investment from our government to ensure that they were able to deliver these programs.

Similarly, we invested in Hope Air, a national charity that provides free flights to people who need to travel for medical care but cannot afford the cost. We have supported them with direct funding from the provincial government as well.

Then, as we've canvassed a few times in the House recently, there’s Angel Flight. Angel Flight East Kootenay, for example, this year will receive $250,000 to help provide people with assistance to travel out of a particularly tricky corner of B.C. that, particularly in the winter, presents risks for people who are travelling.

That's a scan of some of the different supports. I want to assure the member that I think we share that we have a continued need to see more investment and drive to support people who live in rural communities and to enable better access to care, and that's just what we'll do.

Brennan Day: Following up on that question, how many TAP requests were denied or delayed due to the outdated paper-based system? And is that even a metric that the ministry tracks? Why is the TAP system not digitized? And is there funding in this additional $5 million or in the broader $35 billion budget for this modernization?

I can fax it over to you if you'd like, Minister, but I as of yet have not figured out how to use that piece of equipment either. Can the minister explain what's being done to modernize this program, to get it back into the 21st century?

[11:50 a.m.]

Hon. Josie Osborne: Thank you to the member for the question.

I think we would all like to abolish the use of fax machines. And to that point though, too, everything we can do to reduce the administrative burden on physicians and on care providers and on people and make things easier is an important part. So I really appreciate the question.

There were 98,248 travel assistance program approvals that were issued by the ministry for the fiscal year ’23-24, which actually represents an increase of almost 10 percent from the year before that. We do not track the number of forms that are assigned but not used, so I can’t give a number in terms of what forms are not used. Small steps have been taken towards modernizing this. It used to be just paper forms available in triplicate, and now there is the use of digital forms and being able to email them.

But I’ll acknowledge that there are always improvements that can be made in the system in making this easier for everybody, particularly the internal system of tracking this and ensuring that we, again, are reducing the administrative burden on physicians so that they can concentrate their time providing care to people. So I appreciate that question very much.

With that, I move that the committee rise and report progress and ask leave to sit again.

Motion approved.

The committee rose at 11:53 a.m.

The House resumed at 11:53 a.m.

[The Speaker in the chair.]

Mable Elmore: Committee of Supply, Section B, reports progress of the estimates of the Ministry of Health and asks to leave to sit again.

Leave granted.

George Anderson: Committee of Supply, Section A, reports progress on the estimates of the Ministry of Post-Secondary Education and Future Skills and asks to leave to sit again.

Leave granted.

Hon. Spencer Chandra Herbert moved adjournment of the House.

Motion approved.

The Speaker: This House stands adjourned until 1:30 p.m. today.

The House adjourned at 11:54 a.m.