Routine Business

Prayers.

Mr. Speaker: Members, before we start introductions, let us welcome back the member for Nanaimo. [Applause.]

Introductions by Members

Hon. L. Popham: It is my honour to introduce some very special guests today that are joining us at the Legislature — 31 of them, in fact. Thirty-one representatives from the B.C. Agriculture Council are here today to help celebrate Ag Day, my favourite day of the year. They are joined by chair Stan Vander Waal.

The BCAC does incredible work advocating for agriculture in this province. I know they’re looking forward to meeting with all of us on both sides of the chamber, and I appreciate all the time the members are taking to hear about issues about agriculture.

Please join me in welcoming them.

Hon. M. Mark: Well, this week is Apprenticeship Recognition Week, and I have four guests in the chambers that I’d like to introduce. Dason Beaverbone-Townsend is a welding apprentice. Crystal Nassichak is an automotive apprentice. Both are in the foundations program at Camosun College. Joining them are Kyle Preston from the Industry Training Authority — he’s an apprenticeship adviser for the south Island — and Rod Bianchini, the interim COO from the ITA. Will the House please join me in welcoming these movers, these shakers, these builders and these makers.

Hon. H. Bains: It gives me a great deal of pleasure…. I looked in the gallery. My longtime friend Fred Girling is up there. Fred has been involved, I think, ever since he was just out of his diapers and been an activist all his life, helping to improve the lives of working people. Even in his retirement days right now, he’s also very, very active with the retirement community, trying to make seniors’ lives much more affordable and helpful. Please help me give him a warm, warm welcome — Fred Girling.

C. Oakes: As the Minister of Agriculture said, it is also one of my favourite days today, to recognize the importance of agriculture and the constituents who have come down to meet with us, on both sides of the House.

I have a very special guest today, Lynda Atkinson, who is here as part of the agricultural working group. Lynda and the group in Quesnel have done a significant job, in fact, in the region around an agricultural working group, specifically around looking at how we can become an agricultural centre of excellence.

Following the wildfire seasons, we certainly know we need to diversify. Agriculture is incredibly important. I am very proud of the work that this working group is doing.

Maybe just a final note. Both Lynda and her husband were teachers of mine.

It is my pleasure to say thank you for your efforts. I’m incredibly proud to have you here today.

Would the House please help me welcome them.

Hon. B. Ralston: Joining us in the members’ gallery this morning is Ms. Galit Baram, the consul general of Israel based in Toronto. The consul general and I have met before and will meet again today. She also has a number of other meetings with ministers and officials during her day here in Victoria. Will the House please make the consul general of Israel welcome.

A. Olsen: I, too, stand today and welcome all of the members from the B.C. agricultural community that are in and around the precinct today.

[10:10 a.m.]

I had the opportunity to meet with members from the sector earlier this morning at a hotel nearby. I just wanted to raise my hands and thank Heather Stretch and Mickey Aylard, both members from my riding, for the work that they do.

Of course, everybody knows that Saanich North and the Islands is home to some amazing agricultural producers. I raise my hands to all of them for the food they produce for us.

Statements
(Standing Order 25B)

DELTA FARMLAND AND WILDLIFE TRUST

I. Paton: First of all, today, as we welcome the B.C. Agriculture Council and a number of guests for Agriculture Day in Victoria, I would like to speak about our Delta Farmland and Wildlife Trust, which was established in 1993 by a group of farmers and conservationists with an interest in conserving agriculture and wildlife resources in Delta.

This non-profit organization promotes the preservation of over 4,000 acres of farmland and wildlife habitat on the Fraser River delta through cooperative land stewardship with local farmers. These programs integrate research, education and financial incentives to provide farmers with cost-share funding to establish wildlife habitat or invest in long-term soil fertility on their farms.

Five key stewardship programs include winter cover crops, grassland set-aside, hedgerow planting, field liming and laser leveling.

Winter cover crops provide vegetation on fields planted after fall harvest. This shared cost of seed provides winter feed habitat for waterfowl and provides stability and protection to the soil, adding organic matter as well.

Grassland set-aside aims at giving farm fields a rest for a few years while at the same time providing tall, unused grasses as perfect habitat for owls, raptors, rodents and pollinating insects.

Hedgerows and ditch bank grasses are also a funded program that provide year-round wildlife habitat along field edges. Hedgerows provide valuable shade and cover for songbirds, raptors, pheasants and bees.

An annual highlight in Delta is Day at the Farm on Westham Island near Ladner. This event is hosted by the Delta Farmland and Wildlife Trust and provides an incredible opportunity for city folk to connect with real farmers on real farms, experiencing displays, educational hayride tours, demonstrations, food trucks, Clydesdale horse plowing and antique farm equipment displays.

After many years of strained relationships between farmers and conservationists, we now have a collaboration that ensures that land will continue to be available for food production and wildlife conservation well into the future.

APPRENTICESHIP

J. Rice: Every day B.C.’s apprentices work with their hands, heads and hearts to make sure that our roads are safe, that our homes are powered and heated and that our culinary scene is world-class. That’s why I am so pleased to rise and celebrate Apprenticeship Recognition Week, November 4 through 10.

This week honours the thousands of hard-working apprentices throughout B.C. That’s 35,000 adult apprentices, 5,000 youth and 4,000 foundation students waiting to join the workforce. Apprentices are training for over 100 diverse trades, from automotive technicians and welders to chefs and funeral directors.

On top of the 45,000 apprentices and students ready to go right now, it’s expected that there will be about 71,000 new job openings in the trades over the next decade. The high-demand trades include millwrights, heavy-duty mechanics and carpenters. Skilled tradespeople will be needed throughout the province in industries like construction, manufacturing and forestry.

Our government is ready to train the next generation of B.C. workers. There are over 100 trades programs offered at 15 post-secondary institutions as well as private post-secondary institutions all over the province. Just this year seven new trades-training facilities were opened at post-secondary institutions throughout B.C. Students in Vernon, Cranbrook, Terrace, Prince George, Kamloops, Nanaimo and Dawson Creek are enjoying state-of-the-art facilities with world-class instructors. That’s not all. Next year two more facilities will open in Campbell River and Nelson.

There’s a scenario that plays out at worksites all over B.C. Contractors are looking for skilled tradespeople, and too many apprentices can’t get the skills they need without experience. That’s why I’m proud of the community benefits agreement for large-scale public projects.

[10:15 a.m.]

An apprenticeship in the skilled trades is an important entry point to a long-lasting, good-paying career with opportunities around the province. To the apprentices out there: keep creating, keep fixing, keep innovating and, most importantly, keep helping to build the best B.C.

CRAFT BREWERIES IN RICHMOND

J. Yap: Behind every great beer is a great story. Today I have the pleasure to tell you the tales behind Fuggles and Warlock, Britannia Brewing and Monkey 9 Brewing.

Recently the three breweries in Richmond took home four prizes at the 2018 B.C. Beer Awards, an annual competition that features judges from all across North America.

The first winner, Fuggles and Warlock Craftworks, sticks to its motto of “Keeping beer weird.” It took third place in the specialty IPA category with a hoppy and zesty pale ale featuring a hint of lemongrass.

The owners of Monkey 9 say their name is meant to invoke positivity, togetherness, magic and wisdom. They took home a prize with their James Brown ale, a beer with hints of chocolate and biscuit.

Last but not least, Britannia Brewing won two prizes. The company said its mission is to brew best-in-class ales following in the British tradition, and it’s clearly succeeding in that goal.

As the former Parliamentary Secretary for Liquor Policy Reform, I’m very excited that the achievements of our craft brewing industry are being recognized. We modernized B.C. liquor laws to support innovation and cut red tape. The changes we made have enabled many more craft breweries to open and grow. From 2011 to 2017, craft beer sales in B.C. have almost tripled, and British Columbia continues to gain recognition as the craft beer capital in Canada.

Congratulations, again, to the winners based in Richmond. As the saying goes, it’s good to have a warm heart and a cold beer.

ADOPTION AWARENESS

R. Singh: Each year November is proclaimed as Adoption Awareness Month. It is not only a time to raise awareness about children in adoptive care but also a reminder for British Columbians about the thousands here in B.C. and millions worldwide who are looking to be adopted or to adopt and to become families.

We all know that family is the root from where a life grows and thrives. So it is time to give thanks to adoption social workers who work passionately to make families happen by finding loving homes for children. They deserve our sincere gratitude, as do the generous foster families that provide care for so many B.C. children. Their kindness is inspirational to all British Columbians.

Here in B.C., there are three private adoption agencies that the ministry licenses which facilitate adoption across Canada and internationally. There is also the Adoptive Families Association of B.C., which provides pre- and post-adoption support services, educational events and training on behalf of the ministry. The work they do every day not only makes a difference, but it changes lives.

I would like to take this opportunity to ask British Columbians who are ready to start or expand their families to consider adoption as one more way to share their love. I would also like to encourage all British Columbians to create a dialogue about adoption and to raise awareness for the many young people in care in B.C. who are counting on individuals, couples or families to provide the permanent, loving homes that they, like all of us, need.

ALTERNATIVES TO PLASTIC STRAWS

T. Wat: I rise today in the House to talk about two young entrepreneurs from my riding of Richmond North Centre, their good intention and their effort to protect the environment while at the same time provide accessibility to those in need.

Roger Chen and Alfie Hsu have recently launched a green revolution. They suggested that plastic straws be replaced by sugarcane straws that are derived from renewable resources. These sugarcane straws are eco-friendly and compostable.

[10:20 a.m.]

United Nations figures show nearly nine million tonnes of plastic bottles, packaging and other waste enter the ocean each year, killing marine life and entering the human food chain.

Plastic straws add up to about 2,000 tonnes. They also account for about 4 percent of the plastic trash by the number of pieces. According to the city of Vancouver, about 57 million plastic straws are used in Canada every day. A video that showed marine biologists removing a straw from a sea turtle’s nostril went viral in 2015 and raised awareness in our community. I urge all members to go on the website and to take a look.

Many companies, such as Starbucks and Swiss Chalet, have pledged to ban plastic straws. However, critics say cutting out straws may create unintended difficulties for people with mobility limitations. Roger and Alfie came up with an idea to save our planet and, at the same time, provide accessibility to people with disabilities as well as seniors.

They are hoping that the government will support replacing plastic straws with eco-friendly and accessible options, such as sugarcane straws. These straws are made from reusable sugarcane fibre, which is not only a natural source for the material but is also biodegradable. I’m proud of the good intention and innovation of these two young entrepreneurs. Best wishes to them on their endeavours.

B.C. AGRICULTURE DAY

R. Leonard: K’ómoks. It means “the land of plenty” in the language of the K’ómoks people. This past Saturday many of our farmers at home got to showcase their food and food products to the Premier as he toured our bustling farmers market and Natural Pastures, a local cheese producer. These institutions exemplify the growing agricultural sector here in B.C.

Today is B.C. Agriculture Day. It’s a day for all of us to celebrate with farmers and ranchers in praise of B.C. agriculture. It provides good jobs, good food, and it boosts local economies throughout B.C. The province’s Grow B.C., Feed B.C. and Buy B.C. are helping new farmers get into farming, introducing local foods into institutions like hospitals and schools and growing markets for B.C. foods and food products.

There’s value in growing our important agricultural sector, which last year alone saw $3.2 billion in farm cash receipts, up 4 percent from the previous year. A focus on sustainability and food security is resulting in amazing transformations, with B.C.’s world-class new technologies providing solutions to major challenges like pest management and automation in greenhouses.

B.C.’s proximity to markets is a competitive advantage to help grow our agriculture, seafood and food-processing sectors. We all benefit as our high-quality food is appreciated throughout the world, allowing more B.C. products to hit our grocery store shelves.

On the other end of the spectrum, small-scale farmers and processors also add great value, as more and more people seek out local meats, produce and products. During the wildfire season last year, we saw how access to local food became a very real necessity. There’s so much to celebrate this B.C. Agriculture Day, so let’s eat B.C., drink B.C. and be merry, B.C.

Oral Questions

GOVERNMENT RECORDKEEPING POLICIES

S. Bond: I have here the government guide to transitory records, with nearly a dozen examples of non-transitory records. They include things like work schedules, assignments, information about a decision, documentation of a policy matter, instructions, advice, meeting minutes, agendas or useful information that helps explain the history of a relationship, a decision or a project.

Can the minister who is responsible for FOI stand up today, acknowledge that she has read and understands that list and make it clear that she believes that it is unacceptable to delete any emails that fit under this definition?

[10:25 a.m.]

Hon. J. Sims: I want to thank my colleague for that question. It is important for the public to have confidence that their government is managing records properly. All employees are required to keep and dispose of records according to the Information Management Act, which has been in place for a number of years.

We committed to holding ourselves to a higher standard, and admittedly, some examples from earlier in our government may have fallen short of that. But we agreed that extra training sessions should be provided to staff and ministers to ensure they understand how to properly identify and appropriately store government records. That training has been given, and ongoing training is planned.

It is important that rules and best practices are followed, and our government is committed to doing just that.

Mr. Speaker: Prince George–Valemount on a supplemental.

S. Bond: Well, we appreciate that very straightforward and passionate defense of the rules around non-transitory emails.

Let’s walk through an article that was written in July of 2017. That article was in the Vancouver Sun. It related to Marie Della Mattia, and it said that she was one of the Premier’s most trusted advisers, who, during her time in office, worked on special priority files.

Non-transitory records that must be kept include — and the minister, in fact, just agreed — instructions, advice, useful information that helps explain the history of a relationship or a decision.

Does this minister really expect us or British Columbians to believe that absolutely none of Della Mattia’s emails during what is a critical time of transition, during the early days of her administration, fit the definition of non-transitory?

Hon. J. Sims: I want to thank my colleague for her follow-up question.

The freedom-of-information requests were for her sent emails during the very first days of the government’s mandate. The employee was working for only a portion of that time and only part-time. The nature of her work during this time was in-person meetings with the director of communications. She was not involved in operational or policy decisions.

This employee was only a government employee until January 15. After that time she no longer had government email.

Mr. Speaker: The member for Prince George–Valemount on a second supplemental.

S. Bond: Thank you very much. You know, I know the minister is aware that it’s not how many hours that a person works that actually triggers the definition. It’s every single piece of work that a person does when they are working for the government.

On May 31, the Leader of the Official Opposition actually asked the Premier about the missing records of Marie Della Mattia. In response, the Premier acknowledged the breach of FOI rules and said: “I asked my deputy minister to have all information that had been removed from computers as ‘no records’ responses brought back into the system.” It was an easy matter to retrieve the information.

Well, apparently, not quite as easy as the Premier thought. We now know that Della Mattia’s emails are still missing. Simple question to the minister: where are they?

Hon. J. Sims: Thank you to my colleague across the way for her follow-up question, because it gives me an opportunity to follow up on the questions that she has asked and the questions that were asked earlier.

We did recover and review the emails for seven staff who sent “no record” responses from the Premier’s office. Those were recovered by our professional public service. With this complete, we processed past freedom-of-information requests. Where applicable, final responses to these requests were published to government’s Open Information website.

[10:30 a.m.]

Let me repeat again. When it came to this particular individual, why no records came up, she only worked part-time, only for a short time, and the nature of her work — and it’s really important that it’s the nature of her work — during this time was in-person meetings with the director of communications. She was not involved in operational or policy decisions.

M. Stilwell: Yesterday there was a list of 18 individuals that was provided to the minister’s office, individuals who have deleted every single email and text message that they created, for months at a time. The minister states that she’s holding herself and the government to a higher standard. So the Minister of Citizens’ Services should be able to explain to us the continued NDP practice of deleting all emails.

Hon. J. Sims: I want to thank my colleague for that question. I’m absolutely awestruck every time I hear questions from the other side about record management, taking into consideration their track record.

When I look at their track record — it was the Leader of the Opposition who was the minister responsible for freedom of information — they had an embarrassing track record. In a clear violation of the rules, they got caught deleting emails after an FOI request came in. That was wrong. On top of that, they were triple-deleting to cover it up. That’s also wrong. Even when someone blew the whistle on both these practices, they lied about it. That side has nothing to teach us about FOIs.

Mr. Speaker: The member for Parksville-Qualicum on a supplemental.

M. Stilwell: Eighteen news releases were issued by the Minister of Education in September and October of last year. Each one of those would have required decisions to approve not only the content but the quotes. The senior ministerial assistant in that office would have been involved in those decisions and likely much, much more. However, he couldn’t produce a single document — not one, zero records.

How does the Minister of Citizens’ Services explain this?

Hon. J. Sims: I do want to thank my colleague for that follow-up question. As I said yesterday, I did ask my staff to look into the specific request. I got the details from the opposition at 8:45 last night. We have looked into it. This request came in after the person was no longer working in that office. My staff are looking into this particular request, and when I have more information, I’ll be happy to provide it to the member.

FISH HEALTH
AND WILD SALMON PROTECTION

A. Olsen: Clayoquot Sound used to support healthy, vibrant populations of sockeye, chinook, coho, chum and pink salmon. Today those populations are threatened.

Last week Living Oceans issued a report which revealed that sea lice are out of control in Clayoquot Sound. This past spring wild salmon were infected with sea lice at unprecedented levels. Independent monitoring found that 96 percent of wild juveniles carried an average of eight lice per fish. In some cases, fish carried up to 50 sea lice. One to three sea lice can kill a juvenile salmon. In all likelihood, this outbreak could kill off an entire generation of fish from the area.

My question to the Minister of Agriculture is: was her ministry aware of the growing threat of sea lice in B.C. fish farms, and if so, what is she doing to address it?

Mr. Speaker: Minister, before you begin, may I remind members that it is not appropriate to use the word “lie” in the House.

[10:35 a.m.]

Hon. L. Popham: I want to assure the member that our government is committed to keeping our water safe and protecting the health of our wild salmon stocks. The federal government has primary responsibility for fish farms and fish health in our waters. That includes regulating SLICE, tracking drug effectiveness and potential resistances. I understand that DFO is conducting a review of a Cermaq fish farm in Clayoquot Sound to determine whether protocols for reporting and treating an outbreak in the spring were followed.

I’ve had conversations with the federal minister, and he recognizes that things need to change. I’m encouraged by DFO’s recent re-engagement on the west coast and the renewed commitment to addressing fish health and protecting wild salmon. We will continue to work with our federal partners to ensure that they fully recognize and exercise their responsibilities.

Mr. Speaker: The member for Saanich North and the Islands on a supplemental.

A. Olsen: The outbreak in Clayoquot was triggered, as the minister mentioned, by a growing pesticide resistance to SLICE, the single drug approved for sea lice treatment in Canada. In 2014, DFO knew that resistance to SLICE was building. They documented failures in Klemtu in 2013, Esperanza Inlet in 2017 and now Clayoquot Sound in 2018.

The alternative to using SLICE is to dump a cocktail of new drugs and chemicals into our oceans, with untold effects. For wild salmon, this means either an increasing risk of exposure to lethal parasite levels at a time when stocks are critically depressed or, potentially, irreparably harming the marine environment where they live.

My question is to the Minister of Agriculture. I don’t have such a high level of confidence in DFO. We’ve seen that they’re vastly underfunding fish stock analysis. They continue to ignore the growing body of evidence of the threat that open-net fish farms pose on our coast. It really feels like they are bringing the cod fishery plan out here on the west coast.

To the Minister of Agriculture, at what point is our government going to stand up and publicly demand that they take action, that the Department of Fisheries and Oceans respect our coast?

Hon. L. Popham: The member will know that the federal government holds much of the jurisdiction in this area, but as a provincial government, we’ve taken action on the provincial level to protect wild salmon.

In response to First Nations and public concerns around pesticide use, the Ministry of Environment proposed changes to the integrated pest management regulation. People have until November 30 to submit feedback. We’ve introduced rigorous new requirements for salmon farm tenures. We’ve engaged in historic government-to-government talks in the Broughton Archipelago to resolve nations’ long-standing concerns around salmon farms in their territories, and we’ve launched the Wild Salmon Advisory Council.

Although the federal government has a lot of responsibility, we are taking action, and we’re working with the federal government to ensure that they fully exercise their responsibility to address salmon health.

GOVERNMENT RECORDKEEPING POLICIES

P. Milobar: The minister for FOI was correct that Ms. Della Mattia was a member of the Premier’s office until January 2018. As a fan of Paul Harvey growing up, I will now share the rest of the story, though, because after that Ms. Della Mattia became a member and a GCPE employee.

On February 22, she requested that an auto response be put on her government email to redirect people to her Gmail address. On March 5, she emailed again to the GCPE service desk lead to say that she did not want a government email account at all. The same day she received a very clear-cut response: “I always recommend using government email to send and receive government information and data.”

Does the Minister of Citizens’ Services agree that Della Mattia should use a government email account for government business?

Hon. J. Sims: I want to thank my colleague for that question. It is important for the public to have confidence that their government is keeping records. There are very clear rules that exist for usage of your emails and how records should be kept. All employees are required to keep and dispose of records according to the Information Management Act.

[10:40 a.m.]

We committed to holding ourselves to a higher standard, and we have been providing additional training to staff to make sure that they are properly identifying and appropriately storing these records. The training has been done, and we will continue to do ongoing training. It is important that rules and best practices are followed, and our government is committed to doing just that.

Mr. Speaker: Kamloops–North Thompson on a supplemental.

P. Milobar: These are employees at a very high level. One would assume the training would have set in, because on March 8, the issue escalated in an email sent by Della Mattia to the deputy minister of government communications, Evan Lloyd. Della Mattia writes: “I recommend that we delete the GCPE account immediately and continue to have ministers’ offices and others contact me via my Gmail address.”

Now, here is the reply from the GCPE deputy minister: “Agreed. Whoever is responsible, please follow through and delete the GCPE address.”

Will the minister make it clear today that this is wrong, that Gmail should not be used for government business?

Hon. J. Sims: I want to thank my colleague for that question. Policy is very, very clear, as has been our training, that for government business, emails that are provided by government should be used. If, in extenuating circumstances, non-government email has to be used, then we have to make sure that those records are transferred into the government records.

G. Kyllo: On April 26, the Minister of Citizens’ Services said: “We really are very firm, in the outreach we do with employees, to use government emails.” Not only did Della Mattia use her private email. It’s now clear that one of the most senior positions of the public service, a deputy minister, actually approved this indefensible circumvention of policy that this minister is responsible for upholding.

To the Minister of Citizens’ Services, there have to be consequences when people knowingly break the rules. What are the consequences?

Hon. J. Sims: I want to thank my colleague for the opportunity to stand up and make it very, very clear that Ms. Della Mattia was no longer a government employee after January 15. She was a contractor, not a GCPE employee. Her OIC was rescinded January 15, 2018.

Let me be very, very clear. The policy is, for government business, use government email unless there are extenuating circumstances. And if there are, then you make sure that that information is recorded into your government email.

Mr. Speaker: The member for Shuswap on a supplemental.

G. Kyllo: I hope that the minister is not somehow trying to set the tone that if you want to circumvent the rules of the House with respect to the requirement to maintain emails and text messages, well, you just contract the service out. Entire pages of Della Mattia’s emails to senior staff in the Premier’s office are redacted as policy advice or recommendations, clear evidence that she was conducting government business on a private Gmail account and the Premier’s office was fully aware.

Question. Will the Minister of Citizens’ Services do what she should have done already and confirm that government staff are no longer breaking the rules?

[10:45 a.m.]

Hon. J. Sims: Government staff, whether they work in the Premier’s office, the minister’s office or whether they are professional public service, use government emails to do government business — the policy is very clear — unless there are extenuating circumstances. Then they’ve got to make sure that if it has to do with government business, it becomes part of government records. That is what happens with employees, and that is what happens with ministers.

Now, it is very hard to sit on this side of the House and listen to questions from that side of the House about record management and about the use of emails, when they’re a government of “Win at all costs” and triple deletes and have ministers who went on record to say they didn’t ever use email. Mr. Speaker, we are getting this right.

M. Hunt: It’s clear that the deputy minister sanctioned Della Mattia’s use of a private email address. The same deputy minister also signed the public service oath of employment, where he swore to “safeguard confidential information.” The deputy minister broke the rules.

Will the Minister of Citizens’ Services please tell us: what consequences did he face?

Hon. J. Sims: I want to thank my colleague for his question. You know, I’m trying to work out here what it is that the opposition is trying to clarify, because I have answered this question. In this case…

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members, we shall hear the response.

Hon. J. Sims: …the employee OIC was actually rescinded on January 15. After that she was a contractor. While she was an employee, a lot of her work was having conversations with the director of communications, and this did not involve sending lengthy emails. As we’ve said before, all the emails that were “no response” from the Premier’s office….

They were all reviewed by our professional public service, and then every freedom-of-information request that came in was re-processed by the public service. That is what happened. We are committed to making sure that government records are kept and people are following processes.

M. Polak: Let’s see if I can help the minister out a little bit here. It doesn’t matter how long the emails were. It doesn’t matter if she was on contract, as long as she was being paid by the government to do work for government. The fact that many of those emails were redacted…. Why? Because they might contain advice to government. It shows quite clearly that government business was being conducted on a Gmail address. Not only that, but as we have seen, this behaviour was being sanctioned by a deputy minister.

Now, this minister promised an investigation, promised to get to the bottom of it. Here’s what the Premier had to say: “We missed the mark. I acknowledge that…. My senior officials…know full well my profound disappointment….”

With even the Premier being disappointed in this behaviour, why have there been no consequences visited upon those responsible?

[10:50 a.m.]

Hon. J. Sims: I want to thank my colleague for that question. Let me be very, very clear. All the emails from the Premier’s office, the “no responses” that were given, were reviewed for the seven staff who sent “no record” responses, for all of them. With this complete, we processed each and every freedom-of-information request that came in. First, we retrieved, and then we reprocessed. Where applicable, final responses to these requests were published to government’s Open Information website. There’s something novel to that side of the House.

In the meantime, extra training sessions have been provided to all staff and ministers to ensure they understand obligations to properly identify and appropriately store government records. We plan to continue that training because we know it’s a work-in-progress always.

We are committed to holding ourselves to a higher standard. The steps we took to retrieve the records and have our public service review them and then reprocess the FOI request show our commitment to open and transparent government. We are proud of that.

Mr. Speaker: The House Leader for the official opposition on a supplemental.

M. Polak: Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This is how Della Mattia justified her use of Gmail: “Confidential information is only being shared with me in person, not via email.” I seem to recall a time when those on the other side decried the idea of sharing confidential government information only in person and only verbally. My, how quickly the spots on the leopard have changed.

Interjections.

Mr. Speaker: Members. Members, please, we shall hear the question. Thank you.

M. Polak: All of this was to be cleared up through an investigation — an investigation that was announced six months ago, an investigation about which we have heard nothing in terms of reports, findings. We get postings of emails that have been recovered yet missing ones as well. And in the case of Della Mattia, nothing. Nothing. They’re gone. They don’t seem to exist anymore.

The minister can’t hide behind investigations that never seem to wrap up. Instead, it’s time for her to hold people accountable, and it’s time for her to do the simplest thing possible, which the previous government did in response to similar issues. That is to require ministers and staff to keep their sent email items.

Why won’t she do that? I’m wondering what she has to hide.

Hon. J. Sims: I’m so glad that my colleague across the way brought up their own record when it comes to records management and emails. After all, while sitting on this side of the House, they were well known in the public arena, as well as in here, for being a government of triple delete, a government who actually deleted the records after the requests came in and then misled the public when they were asked about it.

On the other hand, I am so proud of the record of our government. As our Premier said, in some areas, we did fall short, but then we took steps to address it. As a teacher, I know how important that is. We took the concerns seriously. We restored the emails for the seven “no response” records. The public service, not ministers, then took the lens of the FOI requests that came in. They reprocessed every request, and guess what. Unlike my colleagues on the other side, we then posted those on the website.

Are we proud of the work we’re doing? Absolutely.

[10:55 a.m.]

[End of question period.]

Standing Order 81.1

SCHEDULE FOR DEBATE ON BILL 53

Hon. M. Farnworth: I rise to advise the House that agreement could not be reached under the provisions of Standing Order 81.1(1) in relation to Bill 53 intituled Recall and Initiative Amendment Act, 2018. Therefore, I move the following motion.

[Pursuant to Standing Order 81.1 (2), all remaining proceedings related to Bill (No. 53) intituled Recall and Initiative Amendment Act, 2018 shall be completed and disposed of on or before Tuesday, November 6, 2018 at 6:30 p.m. At 6:00 p.m. on the date mentioned, the Speaker and the Chair of the Committee of the Whole will forthwith put all necessary questions for the disposal of all remaining stages of the said bill without amendment or debate.

Any divisions called on any section of Bill (No. 53) shall be taken in accordance with Practice Recommendation No. 1. Any division called on any second reading amendments, second reading, or third reading of the said bill may be taken in accordance with Standing Order 16. Proceedings under this motion shall not be subject to the provisions of Standing Order 81, or the Standing or Sessional Orders relating to times and days of the sittings of the House.]

Point of Order

M. Polak: I rise on a point of order.

According to Standing Order 32, a bill being debated would be dropped if, indeed, at the end of that speaking, it wasn’t adjourned for debate and instead was just straight up adjourned.

I note, from reviewing Hansard for yesterday, that that, in fact, is what happened. I’ve got copies of it. The member did not move adjournment of the debate. The member moved adjournment, and that passed.

[11:00 a.m.]

Hon. M. Farnworth: Orders of the day.

Mr. Speaker: Before we get into that, I should note that the motion put forward by the Government House Leader will be on hold until we have the decision raised by the official opposition.