[ Page 10809 ]

The House met at 2:05 p.m.

The Speaker: Hon. members, I call the House to order. We will begin with prayers, first led by elder Mary Anne Thomas of the Esquimalt nation, then by Rev. Rod Robinson, Nisga'a tribal council ambassador. Then we will have a minute's silence for each of us to remember and honour our family, friends and members of our community who have passed away.

Please rise.

Prayer sung and spoken by Mary Anne Thomas. [Coast Salish spoken.]

The Speaker: [Coast Salish spoken.] Amen.

Prayer by Reverend Rod Robinson. [Nisga'a and English spoken.]

The Speaker: Now we'll have a few moments' silence.

Thank you very much, members.

I'd like to welcome to Victoria and to the Legislative Assembly the many distinguished guests who are present this afternoon in the House and also in the precinct. Now it's time for introductions.

Hon. U. Dosanjh: Hon. Speaker, some days ago a prominent journalist in British Columbia was gunned down as he was getting out of his car and into his wheelchair. Mr. Tara Singh Hayer has been a prominent journalist in British Columbia and has spoken against violence and extremism for many, many years, and he is with us no more. I ask the House to express determination on behalf of the people of British Columbia that we shall do everything possible within our power to make sure that those that might be responsible for this suppression of freedom of expression be apprehended, and to send condolences to Mr. Hayer's family as an expression of our feelings as well as our determination on that particular issue.

The Speaker: Thank you, Attorney General. I recognize the Leader of the Official Opposition.

G. Campbell: Hon. Speaker, I join with the Attorney General in recognizing the contribution that Tara Singh Hayer has made to public life in British Columbia. He was a man who lived a life of principle. He believed in freedom of thought and freedom of speech. He believed that people should be free to question one another without intimidation. As his family said the other day at the services, he was a man who gave much, not just to his family but to his community and to all of the people of British Columbia and Canada. I am pleased to join with the Attorney General in asking that this assembly send our condolences to the family. We all remember Tara Singh Hayer for the example that he set about how we can contribute to public life in the province of British Columbia.

The Speaker: Thank you, member. I would assure the members that those condolences will indeed be sent forward.

I recognize now the hon. Premier.

[2:15]

As well, in the gallery today are some friends of mine that I'd like everyone to welcome: the Duxbury family of Glenn, Faye, Evan and Claire.

To all the Nisga'a here in the gallery, in the Nass Valley and across British Columbia. . . . I'd ask all members to make them welcome.

Hon. D. Miller: Normally, introductions are used by members to introduce their constituents. Were I to do that today we'd be here all day, I think.

I want to welcome all of my friends from the Nass. I would like to introduce, for the members: Dr. Frank Calder, seated here on the floor of the House, president emeritus of the Nisga'a nation and former MLA for Atlin; Larry Guno, a friend of this House and former MLA for Atlin; Harry Nyce Jr., the resources negotiator for the Nisga'a tribal council; and Deanna Nyce, his spouse and executive director of the Wilp Wilxo'oskwhl Nisga'a, a very progressive institution that's delivering training into the Nass Valley; Tom Berger, the distinguished former Chief Justice of the B.C. Supreme Court; Dick McMaster, from the B.C. Fishing Resorts and Outfitters Association; Jack Ebbels, a former chief negotiator and some now say an individual who's gone on to his reward as my deputy in Energy and Mines -- we'll see; John Radosevic, the president of the United Fishermen and Allied Workers Union -- I've worked with John for years; and Jack Nichol -- an individual for whom I have a lot of esteem -- former president of the United Fishermen and Allied Workers Union and a member of the advisory committee, TNAC. I would ask the House to welcome all of these people here.

Hon. D. Lovick: I also have the honour today to welcome to our chamber a number of distinguished visitors: first, Rev. Rod Robinson, who is the ambassador of the Nisga'a nation; second, Marjorie Robinson, accompanying Rod; third, Mr. Edward Allen, chief executive officer of the Nisga'a tribal council. As well, Robert Louie of the First Nations Summit is in the precincts. George Watts, an adviser to the working group of the Summit, is in the precincts, I understand. As well, in the gallery today I want to acknowledge the presence of Mr. Tom Molloy, who is the chief negotiator for Canada; Mr. Trevor Proverbs, who was the chief provincial negotiator at the Nisga'a table and who is now working on the Vancouver Island negotiating table; and finally, Ms. Carole Corcoran of the Indian Claims Commission. I would ask my colleagues to please join me in making all of these worthy people most welcome.

Hon. J. MacPhail: It's my pleasure today to join others in welcoming people who have joined us on the floor of the Legislature and in the gallery as well -- all people who have contributed to the debate at the public level in this province. First of all, Brian Smith, chair of B.C. Hydro, is on the floor of the chamber. Angela Schira, secretary-treasurer of the B.C. Federation of Labour, joins us on the floor. Derick Cheng of

[ Page 10810 ]

Hon. J. Kwan: I too would like to join my colleagues in welcoming all the special friends who are with us today. In particular, I'd like to recognize three individuals. They are Reg Percival, the chief councillor of the village of Gitlakdamiks; Perry Asak, chief councillor of the village of Gitwinkshilw; and finally, Gary Alexcee, chief councillor of the village of Gingolx. Would the House please make them very welcome.

Hon. A. Petter: Joining us in the House today, both in the gallery and on the floor, are a number of representatives of first nations from this area of the province -- that is to say, from the area of southern Vancouver Island -- and I would just like to mention a few. Like my colleagues, I couldn't mention all of the representatives here, but I'd certainly like the House to join me in welcoming, amongst others, Chief Vern Jacks of the Tseycum first nation; Chief Andrew Thomas of the Esquimalt nation; Mary Anne Thomas, an elder with the Esquimalt first nation who brought us a prayer to start our sitting this afternoon; and in addition, speaker Willie Seymour of the Coast Salish people. Also joining us is Mavis Gillie of Aboriginal Neighbours, a group working in support of aboriginal rights -- she's someone who worked on behalf of aboriginal rights for a long, long time, I might say -- along with Dr. Philip Hewitt of the Unitarian Church of Canada. I'd like the House to join me in making them and others from this area feel most welcome here this afternoon.

H. Giesbrecht: With us today are two people that I'd like to recognize because of their efforts to make this occasion a reality. First is Joanne Monaghan, chair of the regional district of Kitimat-Stikine. Unfortunately, Joanne couldn't be with us. She had to decline her invitation at the very last minute due to some family commitments, but she really wanted to be here to show her support, and she's here in spirit.

Joining us in the gallery is George Thom, past mayor of Kitimat, who also served on the regional district of Kitimat-Stikine. He's now a resident of Bulkley Valley-Stikine, so my colleague and I had to toss a coin to see who was going to introduce him. George was selected by the Northwest Communities Coalition to be a representative for them on the Kitimat-Stikine treaty advisory committee. He was part of the negotiating team for the province. I'm proud to introduce George and to recognize him here for his work. Would the House please make him welcome.

J. Smallwood: It's my pleasure and indeed my honour to join my colleagues in welcoming special guests. I'd like to welcome Chief Robert Sam from the Songhees band; Tom Sampson, a respected elder from the Tsartlip band; Aziz Khaki of the Council of Muslim Communities of Canada; Rev. Ed Searcy from the United Church of Canada; Jane Middleton of the Aboriginal Rights Coalition; and Bill Yee from the Chinese Benevolent Association. For all of those that have not yet been named, I would like to extend a warm welcome to the House and the gallery.

G. Wilson: I would also like to extend a welcome to all those who have travelled from the Nass to be with us today and to point out two others whose voices have been very strong: one has been mentioned already, Mr. Aziz Khaki, president of the Committee for Racial Justice; and also someone whose voice was heard in this chamber and who continues to speak out for racial justice in British Columbia, the former member for Okanagan East, my wife Judi Tyabji-Wilson.

Hon. D. Zirnhelt: Travelling a long way from the Cariboo area are three chiefs that I'd like the House to welcome: Chief Antoine Archie from Canim Lake, Chief Larry Camille from the Canoe Creek band, and Chief Nancy Sandy from the Williams Lake band. Please make them welcome.

The Speaker: A further introduction by the Minister of Aboriginal Affairs and Minister of Labour.

Hon. D. Lovick: Thank you very much, Madam Speaker. I hope my colleagues will indulge me. As I look around, I saw some people whose names were inadvertently omitted. I'd therefore like to make the House aware of the presence of Chief Joe Mathias from the Squamish band; Mr. Miles Richardson, who is the new chair of the B.C. Treaty Commission; and also Mr. James Johnny, chief of the Snuneymuxw, or the Nanaimo first nation. Would my colleagues make these people welcome too.

Ministerial Statement

TRIBUTE TO NISGA'A PEOPLE AND NEGOTIATORS OF NISGA'A TREATY

I think all of you will agree that the ceremony we had in the front was highly symbolic. You will recall the fact that 111 years ago, the Nisga'a people, along with the Tsimshian people, travelled over 1,000 kilometres by canoe in February of 1887. They came to the parliament and the Premier of the day to seek justice, to seek reconciliation, to seek aboriginal rights and aboriginal title, and, first and foremost, to seek the negotiation of a treaty. In spite of the fact that treaties had been negotiated or were being negotiated in every other province in Canada, the government of the day sought to reject that claim.

It is a tribute to the people here today, particularly a tribute to the people of the Nass Valley, that after 111 years they maintained their position -- their legal position, their moral position. They maintained consistently, for all these years, that their rights had not been extinguished -- that title still existed today -- and they sought justice. Today we're here, I think, symbolically welcoming the Nisga'a people to this place -- to the people's chamber -- to seek justice.

I want to thank the negotiators for Canada. Tom Molloy is here, and I'm sure members of his team are here, as well, who worked, in some cases for 30 years, to try to resolve this issue. I want to thank the British Columbia negotiators, including previous governments and a former member, now the member for Peace River South, and many others who worked so hard on the British Columbia side: Trevor Proverbs; Jack Ebbels; the member for Coquitlam-Maillardville; my immediate predecessor, Mike Harcourt; and so many others from the British Columbia side who worked and gave years of their lives in negotiation.

Most importantly, of course, I want to thank the Nisga'a, and not just the leadership but all the Nisga'a people, whose struggle for 111 years has been characterized by integrity,

[ Page 10811 ]

G. Campbell: I join with the Premier in welcoming to this discussion all the people who are here with us today and who are watching this across the province. The colourful spectacle that we witnessed today will long be remembered as the day the Nisga'a were finally received in the Legislative Assembly of the province of British Columbia. The carefully planned ceremonies and celebrations will leave their indelible mark on the pages of history.

Regardless of how the events of the next several weeks and months unfold, the symbolism of what has happened today will be lost on nobody. It reminds us all of the difficult past behind us and the challenges yet ahead. It makes us remember how we got here and how long it took for us to get here. It makes us aware of our own place in history and suggests only one correct course of action: to right the present for the future.

What can I say at a moment like this, to give this time justice? What can I say to show my respect for the Nisga'a people and to all first nations -- to reinforce my strong desire to negotiate workable, affordable treaties that will honourably advance our long march as a society to reconciliation? What can I say when my vision for achieving that end is fundamentally at odds with aspects of the template for treaties that the Nisga'a and the government now expect this assembly to endorse? Nothing, perhaps, that will satisfy the negotiators.

[2:30]

We share a goal, but we differ on the path to achieve it. Can we dare to disagree and yet respect one another? We recognize that governments and private institutions have not always acted in a way that is honourable and respectful of aboriginal people. We recognize that some individuals in the past have abused their positions of trust. We recognize that the legacy of the Indian Act in particular has shamed our nation, as it has patronized first nations and locked them into a reserve system that has failed us all miserably. The social and economic ills that are endemic to reserve life are undeniable and inexcusable.

For all that pain and suffering -- for which our country, our province and this Legislature bear some responsibility -- I wish to say one thing from the bottom of my heart: I am sorry. Our caucus is sorry. With the indulgence of the members opposite, perhaps we can say that in a more formal way by way of a resolution at some later date. For now, however, I hope that my apology will put what I want to say in context.

The greatest respect is shown not in silence but in open and honest debate. Tomorrow the debate on the proposed Nisga'a treaty will begin in this assembly. We welcome that debate as an opportunity to engage the government in a public discussion on our respective visions for treaty settlements in British Columbia. Many of the people watching from the gallery and on television today have a special interest in our deliberation, as they too are participants in the treaty process. But we and they must also know that the eyes of all British Columbians are upon us.

As they watch and listen to us, many of those people will be wondering when and why they came to be nothing more than spectators in this great debate. They will wonder why they have been relegated to the sidelines on an issue of such great consequence to their lives and to the future of our province. They will applaud the goal of treaty-making. But they will question why this template for treaties was made without their approval. They will agree or disagree with the respective positions that each of us takes here in this House. They will agree or disagree with our differing visions for reconciling the rights of aboriginal people with the sovereignty of the Crown.

But they will not be allowed to express their support or disapproval of this government's vision for treaties by way of a vote. They will be denied that right to vote on their negotiating mandate for treaties and the principles that will forever change B.C. as we know it. They will be denied the right to vote for one reason: because this government doesn't trust their judgment, and it doesn't have enough confidence in its own vision to let people have a say.

And that, hon. Speaker, is wrong. It's wrong because it demonstrates a profound lack of faith in the collective wisdom of the people of British Columbia. It's wrong because it suggests that we shouldn't challenge ourselves as a society to ascertain whether this template for treaties is consistent with the wishes of British Columbians. It's wrong because it continues the pattern of paternalism and denial that has been the central hallmark of our country's sad relations with aboriginal peoples: hear no evil; speak no evil; see no evil. Only in this case it is not what is happening on the reserve that we are seeking to sweep under the carpet; it is the contemplation of the world we want to build together.

Hopefully, this debate will allow us all to address that question, as we address the Nisga'a template, with dignity, with honesty and with mutual respect.

G. Wilson: I rise to seek leave to respond to the ministerial statement.

Leave granted.

G. Wilson: Hon. Speaker, it is always a privilege to stand in this chamber and have a chance to speak to matters that deal with our future. It is particularly an honour to stand in this Legislative Assembly today and to be able to address what will undoubtedly be a historic session.

It is particularly meaningful to me that I have an opportunity to be in this Legislative Assembly to address the Nisga'a agreement, because it allows me to reflect back on a conversation that I had with a number of first nations chiefs who are here today -- and some who are not -- in 1991, when we were fighting the Charlottetown accord. I took such a strong opposition to the Charlottetown accord, and many first nations were most disappointed, many were hurt, and some did not understand my opposition to the accord. At that time, I was the leader of different party, and I see some of my colleagues are still here today in the same party.

I sat before these members, these aboriginal leaders, and I argued passionately, not only with them but with the British

[ Page 10812 ]

Some of the leaders -- and I turn to Chief Mathias, who is here today -- said to me: "Gordon, we don't trust that this can happen, because if we do this -- if we change our position, if we negotiate an agreement under section 35 -- when the time comes to ratify, your society, your government, will change its mind. It will move the goalpost. It will take us to court and fight against us." And I said at that time to those aboriginal leaders: "I give you my word that if you negotiate within the existing language of section 35, it will be honoured, it will be passed and we will finally be able to proceed forward into the future as equals."

Hon. Speaker, I believe we have accomplished it. I turn to those colleagues who were with me at the time and say that it is time today for us to honour our word. We gave our word it could be done. It has been done, and we now need to do it.

I have been able, over the last number of months, to hold nine town halls with British Columbians, many of whom had no understanding of the text of this agreement, many of whom came in quite angry, quite hostile and quite solid in their opposition to this agreement. I believed then and I believe now even more so, having had those nine town halls, that if the British Columbia people read and understand the letter of this agreement, they will support it. They will support it because it gives a face to the Nisga'a people. This is not an agreement of this government; this is not an agreement of this Premier. This is an agreement for the Nisga'a people. It gives them a face, it gives them equality, and it allows them to be equal partners in British Columbia. And that must be a good thing, not a bad thing.

Over the next number of weeks we are going to have an opportunity to debate. I look forward to tackling those issues that people in opposition to this agreement have brought forward. Today suffice it for me to ask this question. Of those who oppose this agreement, I ask two questions. If not this agreement, what agreement? And if not now, when?

J. Weisgerber: Madam Speaker, I too seek leave to respond to the ministerial statement.

Leave granted.

J. Weisgerber: Today marks the beginning of the final chapter in the Nisga'a quest for the settlement of their land claims, a resolution to the land question, something we've heard many times -- a process that started more than a century ago. And during that time, the Nisga'a have always demonstrated great dignity and perhaps even greater determination.

My involvement in this issue spans a much shorter time. Ten years ago I was appointed as British Columbia's first Minister of Native Affairs. We struck a committee known as the Premier's Council on Native Affairs. One member, Chief Robert Louie, is with us here today. On July 25, 1990, the committee recommended that British Columbia participate in treaty negotiations. On March 20, 1991, I had the privilege of travelling to the Nass Valley to sign the framework agreement, bringing British Columbia to the treaty table for the first time in history.

Much has happened since that time. I looked at the framework agreement today. Section 2(1) set a target of two years from the signing of that agreement to reach an agreement-in-principle. Somebody drug their feet a bit. Not surprisingly, it took longer than that. But I think it demonstrates the optimism that was so much a part of that, for me, very memorable day in 1991.

Today we start the debate in this Legislature of the first treaty ever negotiated by the province of British Columbia. In saying that, I recognize Treaty 8 in my own constituency in the northeast, but that was never negotiated by British Columbia, and British Columbia was never a signatory to it.

This treaty will be, without question, a template for future treaties. As I look around the room at the many, many leaders who are here today, I don't think many would dispute that the Nisga'a agreement has been and will be on the negotiating table as a base point for negotiations. I think that first nations and aboriginal people in this province are very fortunate to have had the Nisga'a to lead the way, to have shown the path and to have negotiated a treaty which can, in fact, serve in that respect.

Madam Speaker, there's a wide range of opinion among British Columbians about this treaty and about this issue. Some -- many -- are in favour of it. Many more are opposed to it. Some simply want an opportunity to voice their opinions directly, by way of referendum. But the government has decided that the 75 members of this assembly will be those who will speak on behalf of all British Columbians on this most important issue.

This is not the time for political opportunism nor for gamesmanship. Now is the time for us to debate this matter with seriousness, with dignity and with respect. Indeed, it is an opportunity and a responsibility for us, as members of this assembly, to allow members to voice the various range of opinions that exist in this province, for if they're not going to be spoken here, they'll be spoken elsewhere.

So, members, I urge you: treat this matter with the respect and the importance that it deserves.

The Speaker: Thank you, members, for the statement and for those responses.

[2:45]

Introduction of Bills

NISGA'A FINAL AGREEMENT ACT

Hon. G. Clark: Hon. Speaker, this bill is truly one of the most historic pieces of legislation ever to come before this chamber. It deals with the great unfinished business of British Columbia: the question of aboriginal land claims, a question with profound moral, legal and economic implications for all

[ Page 10813 ]

Hon. Speaker, with all due respect to the duty of this chamber to consider this bill, let me say that it is time for us to get on with it -- to put the inequities of the past behind us and to get on with the work of building a stronger, more prosperous British Columbia. I am deeply honoured to be able to table this historic legislation today.

I move the bill be read a first time now.

Bill 51 introduced, read a first time and ordered to be placed on orders of the day for second reading at the next sitting of the House after today.

Oral Questions

HEALTH CARE IN B.C.

My question to the Minister of Health is: when is this government going to stop attacking the caregivers of British Columbia and start listening to their concerns?

Hon. P. Priddy: Hon. Speaker, just to put this question into a bit of context -- and I will answer the question about support for the health care workers that are currently in a labour dispute. . . . But let's put this in some context. All across this country, every single province is having challenges in the health care system. There's no question that there are problems with staffing, there are problems with wait-times and there are problems with services for the growing number of elderly. No question -- every province struggles with that.

The difference between other provinces and this one in how we solve that is the fact that in this province we spend 35 percent of our entire provincial budget on health care -- more than any other province in the country.

The Speaker: The minister will conclude, please.

Hon. P. Priddy: Yes, hon. Speaker, I will.

Aside from the fact that this is the province that has increased its health budget every year -- unlike other provinces, which have decreased it -- with the dispute currently going on, I have said very clearly, as the Health minister, that the issues of workload, which are the main issues that nurses have brought to the table, are understood by this government. And those initiatives are currently being bargained at the table.

The Speaker: First supplementary, the Leader of the Official Opposition.

G. Campbell: The minister should try telling Erna Lach, an 80-year-old pensioner whose knee-replacement surgery was cancelled, that our health care system in British Columbia is working. Try telling Graham McCracken, whose prostate cancer surgery was cancelled indefinitely, that this government's health care policies are working. Try telling the one out of five children who are being held up for surgeries beyond the prescribed limits that our health care system in the province is working. Instead of attacking our caregivers, why won't the minister commit today to stop running taxpayer-funded advertisements that attack our doctors and our nurses, and get on with solving the health care problem?

Hon. P. Priddy: This government is not in any way, shape or form attacking nurses. As a matter of fact, we've recognized the issues of workload. We've also said that we thought that this could be settled without work action. The fact that nurses have taken work action -- you're right -- has caused some elective surgeries to be cancelled, and that's frustrating and that's anxiety-producing for the patients and their families. No question about that. The people are back at the table today. I expect them to work hard; I expect a solution.

The Speaker: Second supplementary, the Leader of the Official Opposition.

G. Campbell: Again the Minister of Health ignores the plight of patients in the province of British Columbia. It isn't because of the nurses that Russ Donaldson is not able to get his cardiac surgery, which was cancelled indefinitely. It is not because of nurses that John Nieson had to fly to Vancouver from Prince George, only to be told that his surgery was cancelled. Why doesn't the minister stop making excuses and start getting on with solving the problem so patients get care in British Columbia regardless of where they live?

Hon. P. Priddy: I would think that if all those people that the member has just referred to were keeping patients at the centre of their focus, as the Health ministry does and as this government does, then we would not be seeing a number of the issues that the Leader of the Opposition has raised -- if patients are indeed at the centre of a health care team and at the centre of the focus of health care. That is the primary concern. That is the reason we're working so hard to have people get back to the table and get a collective agreement that firstly meets the needs of patients, meets the needs of nurses and meets the needs of taxpayers.

CHILDREN'S SURGERY WAIT-LISTS

Hon. P. Priddy: I don't think, as the Health minister, that I have ever said there are no problems in the health care system. I don't think I've ever glossed over children in any way, shape or form and said not to worry. But what this report

[ Page 10814 ]

The Speaker: First supplementary, the member for Okanagan West.

S. Hawkins: Parents and children are tired of this minister's lame excuses and the NDP's empty promises that they're going to find solutions for those children. This minister should know that it's absolutely necessary for those little kids to get their surgery on time, to keep within the acceptable time frames, to keep within their growth and development changes. My question again is to this Health minister: how can she stand idly by launching self-serving ad campaigns while little children are forced to wait longer and longer for treatment that they desperately need?

Hon. P. Priddy: The children and their families that wait longer than acceptable times for surgery are indeed a concern. We do actually have an active plan, working with the Children's Hospital, to bring some relief to this. The Children's Hospital here is the first hospital that's ever done a comparative wait-time to be able to measure against other hospitals across the country.

But I'm a bit puzzled. This is the same opposition that said $6 billion was enough of a budget for health care. We spend $7.2 billion on health care, and they've said $6 billion is enough. So I'm not sure, after we cut the $1.2 billion to get to $6 billion, where this opposition thinks the money will come from to be able to expand those services. Perhaps they think the model in Ontario that Premier Harris is using, where he is closing 37 hospitals and laying off 6,600 nurses. . .

The Speaker: Thank you, minister.

Hon. P. Priddy: . . .is a model we should look at.

The Speaker: Thank you, minister.

Hon. P. Priddy: We believe in a B.C. model, hon. Speaker.

B.C. HYDRO CEO DISMISSAL

Hon. G. Clark: I think all members of the House know the history of this case. Mr. Sheehan was the president. . .

Interjections.

The Speaker: Members, members, we heard the questions; let's hear the answer.

Hon. G. Clark: . . .and CEO of B.C. Hydro. Inappropriate actions were brought to light, and he was dismissed. It was very unfortunate. Mr. Sheehan had spent many years at B.C. Hydro and did a good job, but those inappropriate actions resulted in his dismissal, which I supported. Of course, as is common, he is suing B.C. Hydro for that. This is common in such a matter. If I am called to testify, of course I will testify. I have no fear of that whatsoever.

The Speaker: First supplementary, Opposition House Leader.

G. Farrell-Collins: Mr. Sheehan is the one person other than the Premier who knows the exact extent of his involvement in the B.C. Hydro scandal. Will the Premier assure us that whatever settlement he and B.C. Hydro come to with Mr. Sheehan, it will not include a confidentiality agreement that will forever seal the facts about this case from the people of British Columbia? In the spirit of finding the truth about what happened at B.C. Hydro, will he assure British Columbians that there will not be a confidentiality agreement?

Interjections.

The Speaker: Order, members.

Hon. G. Clark: It is tempting to ask whether the member for Matsqui would himself relinquish the same confidentiality arrangements. I'm not handling this case; B.C. Hydro lawyers are handling this case. I have no idea if there is going to be a settlement or not.

Interjection.

The Speaker: Hon. member. . . .

Hon. G. Clark: They are going to court, as is quite commonly the case with wrongful dismissal suits. If I am called to testify, I am happy to do so.

Interjections.

The Speaker: Order, order, hon. members.

ROLE OF PREMIER'S STAFF MEMBERS IN B.C. HYDRO AFFAIRS

Hon. G. Clark: Well, that member ought to know about being humble and self-effacing.

Mr. Schreck did a superb job on the board of B.C. Hydro, you may recall. Actually, he did a lie detector test, hon.

[ Page 10815 ]

[3:00]

M. de Jong: It sounds to me more like a case of rich men tell no tales, hon. Speaker. It really does.

Mr. Sheehan issued a statement in March, and he said that the Premier had direct representation at Hydro board meetings that took place in the presence of Mr. Dix and MLA David Schreck. My question to the Premier today, however, is: now that he's decided to reunite the dream team of Schreck and Dix, will they be reassuming conduct of the Hydrogate file within the Premier's Office? Is that what's going to happen now?

The Speaker: I recognize the member for Vancouver-Quilchena.

AUDITOR GENERAL REPORT ON '96-97 BUDGET

The Speaker: Hon. member. . . .

C. Hansen: Concerns about the budget process prompted the auditor general of this province to launch an investigation. . . .

Interjections.

The Speaker: Hon. members will come to order, and the member will phrase his question appropriately.

C. Hansen: I will. My question is to the Premier. Has the Premier seen any part of the auditor general's draft report into his government's budget lies?

Hon. G. Clark: No.

The Speaker: The member for Vancouver-Quilchena on a supplementary.

C. Hansen: I understand that Tom Gunton has been the centre of the auditor general's attention in his investigation. Again my question is to the Premier. Has Tom Gunton retained counsel with respect to the auditor general's report? And are the taxpayers paying for Tom Gunton's legal fees?

Hon. G. Clark: I am not absolutely sure, but I think that all members. . . . As soon as the auditor general sought legal counsel, paid for by the taxpayers. . . . Many of the individuals called to testify -- public servants -- have sought and retained legal counsel. It's quite appropriate. Public policy, government policy, which goes back prior to this government, approves of public funds being used to defend civil servants in such matters. So I'm sure that many of them have lawyers, and they're all paid for by the taxpayers.

The Speaker: Thank you, hon. members. Question period is now over. I recognize the Minister of Finance.

Hon. J. MacPhail: Hon. Speaker, in question period the member that just spoke cast aspersions on the integrity of each member sitting on this side by stating that we had lied. I would ask that he withdraw that. He cast aspersions on this entire side of the House, hon. Speaker.

The Speaker: Thank you, minister. The Chair will. . . .

I recognize the member for Vancouver-Quilchena.

C. Hansen: I will withdraw that remark.

The Speaker: Thank you, member.

Tabling Documents

Hon. Speaker, on an auspicious day like this, when we have a chance to celebrate together, I move that the House do now adjourn -- to other hallways.

Hon. J. MacPhail moved adjournment of the House.

Motion approved.

The House adjourned at 3:05 p.m.

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