The committee met at 8:16 a.m.

[B. D’Eith in the chair.]

B. D’Eith (Chair): Good morning, everyone. Welcome.

My name is Bob D’Eith. I’m the MLA for Maple Ridge–​Mission and the Chair of the Select Standing Committee on Finance and Government Services.

I’d like to begin by acknowledging the Haisla people of the Kitamaat Village, on whose traditional territory this meeting is taking place.

We are a committee of the Legislative Assembly that includes MLAs from the government and opposition parties. Normally, we travel and do public consultations and visit different regions of the province in the fall to hear directly from British Columbians about their priorities and ideas for the next budget. This year we’ve moved our consultation to June to enable the committee to deliver a final report to the Legislative Assembly earlier in the budget process. We’ll be reviewing this new timeline and welcome your feedback on this change.

Our consultation is based on the budget consultation paper that was released by the Minister of Finance. There are copies of this paper available at the back for anyone who is interested.

In addition to these in-person meetings, the committee also invites British Columbians to provide their thoughts in writing or by filling in an on-line survey. Details are available on our website at www.leg.bc.ca/cmt/finance. The deadline for input is 5 p.m., Friday, June 28, 2019.

All of the input we receive will be carefully considered as the committee develops its recommendations to the Legislative Assembly on what should be in the next provincial budget. Our report will be available in late July or early August. To those of you who are here today, thank you for taking the time to meet with us and share your ideas.

As far as the format, I just want to kindly remind everyone to respect the following time limits: each presenter has five minutes to share their input, followed by five minutes for questions from the committee. You’re welcome to provide any further information in writing.

If there’s anyone who hasn’t registered in advance but would like to speak to the committee, please see Stephanie at the information table, and we’ll do our very best to accommodate you.

Today’s meeting is being recorded and transcribed. All audio from our meeting is broadcast live via our website, and a complete transcript will also be posted.

Now I would like to have the members introduce themselves, starting with Rich Coleman.

R. Coleman: Rich Coleman. I’m the MLA for Langley East.

N. Simons: I’m Nicholas Simons. I’m the MLA for Powell River–​Sunshine Coast.

D. Clovechok: Doug Clovechok. I’m the MLA for Columbia River–​Revelstoke, out in the Kootenays.

R. Leonard: I’m Ronna-Rae Leonard. I’m the MLA for Courtenay-Comox on Vancouver Island.

M. Dean: I’m Mitzi Dean. I’m the MLA for Esquimalt-Metchosin.

D. Ashton (Deputy Chair): Good morning. My name is Dan Ashton. I’m the MLA for Penticton to Peachland.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Once again, my name is Bob D’Eith. I’m the MLA for Maple Ridge–Mission.

Assisting the committee today are Susan Sourial and Stephanie Raymond from the Parliamentary Committees Office. Steve Weisgerber and Amanda Heffelfinger from Hansard Services are recording proceedings. I also did want to thank Hansard back in Victoria, who are also working behind the scenes to broadcast this today.

First up we have Kitimat CDC — Marianne Hemmy.

Good morning.

[8:20 a.m.]

Budget Consultation Presentations

KITIMAT COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT CENTRE

M. Hemmy: Good morning. Thank you for the opportunity to present to the Legislative Assembly’s Select Standing Committee on Finance. I’m speaking on behalf of the children and families we serve for the Kitimat Community Development Centre. My name is Marianne Hemmy. I’m the executive director.

I stand before you now as someone who is becoming increasingly exhausted by the energy it takes to advocate for the most vulnerable people in our community. As a non-profit community agency, we strive to meet needs in our community for children, youth and family services. Our services have, over the years, expanded to include contracts and supportive homelessness prevention, housing resource referral services as well as services to seniors through our Better at Home program.

Roughly 50 percent of our funding comes from the Ministry of Children and Family Development, with the other 50 percent being made up of contracts through the CLBC, B.C. Housing, PGNAETA, United Way and the school district, among others.

We support the commitment of the ministries — Ministry of Education, Health, Ministry of Children and Family Development and other ministries, as relevant — to be working together on addressing needs for children and families. We urge that all budget and policy decisions be based on principles of integrated services. As a centre in Kitimat providing a range of early intervention, prevention and support services for over 40 years, we are putting forth a strong recommendation that funding for services for children and youth with special needs be adequately funded and be a protected stream of service within the Ministry of Children and Family Development.

Funding for children with special needs has not increased significantly since 2008, and the zero-base, no increase in budgets and no new funding being provided means that there is a wide gap between the demands for services and the ability to provide services. Not having early services results in decreased readiness for children to enter and succeed in the school system, can increase the need to access health services and is ignoring the evidence that early interventions can make significant differences in children’s development.

One area where I’m challenged today is understanding the current government’s decision to flow $40 million for low-wage redress in the social service sector only to union agencies. Non-union agencies are excluded from the wage redress program. This leaves 17,000 non-union workers with a wage differential of around 12 percent compared to their 15,000 unionized counterparts. My head hurts at the very thought of this.

As mentioned above, we are a non-profit agency holding multiple and varied contracts serving the needs of people in our community. With the announcement of the financial investment decision taken by LNG Canada in October of 2018, our community has felt the immediate impact. We are currently just on the cusp of the project, and honestly, we have no idea where we’re going to be in another year from now.

The immediate concern and challenge that we experience is the impact that the promise of the LNG project has put on our housing market. I’m fully supportive of free enterprise, but I’m baffled by the perceived lack of planning on a provincial level that the commitment of hiring local has had on our community. What we are experiencing today — my quote — is a virtual black hole, leaving the employers of our front-line workers that need to be in place in order to support the very fabric of our community — our restaurants, banks, grocery stores, etc. — with the inability to find staff, as the individuals that held those positions have moved on to work on the project.

Although we have an influx of individuals coming into town, they are immediately met with the reality that there’s nowhere for them to live. We have a 40 percent to 45 percent vacancy rate in Kitimat, but the majority of these vacancies are either not available for rent or not at the price point that can be afforded by an individual who may be making — I picked $17 an hour — in the range of $15 to $17 an hour.

Now we see an immediate increase in people struggling to meet their basic needs, such as food and shelter. Kitimat does not have a year-round shelter. We do not have a soup kitchen. We have a huge shortage of affordable housing.

[8:25 a.m.]

As the ED of a non-profit agency, I find myself being sucked into spending a huge part of my time in what I would call the service gaps in our community. This time is not supported by any of the contracts that we hold and essentially ends up being advocacy work done off the side of my desk.

The perceived systematic erosion of non-profits in this province is resulting in burnout by the front-line workers. These are the individuals in our community who work directly with the most vulnerable, those in crisis. When these workers burn out, where will we be?

We support that the core services in health education and social services must be in place and adequately funded to serve as a foundation in communities for economic development and for healthy communities.

I thank you for the opportunity to stand before you and share our current challenges. I want to acknowledge my awareness of the importance of economic development and its relationship to the many changes we are experiencing in the northwest. In particular, I want to highlight how these changes are affecting the demands on our services. I urge that all budget decisions balance the attention to job creation and investment with the need for protecting and enhancing the social health and education fabric of our communities.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Thank you very much.

R. Coleman: Thanks, Marianne. I appreciate that.

Are you the only organization of your kind in this town?

M. Hemmy: Well, no. I can’t say that, but there are not very many of us.

R. Coleman: Right. But you would be the major deliverer here, with all of those different contracts you’ve got? I don’t think you’re missing any, right? Any aspects — like in your contracts.

M. Hemmy: We collaborate with the Kitimat Community Services Society. Also, the Tamitik Status of Women, I understand, will be before you later on today.

R. Coleman: Okay. Thank you.

N. Simons: I think some of us might have been confused. You’re the child development centre, but we didn’t hear about….

M. Hemmy: We are currently…. Our name was changed. We’re the community development centre, previously the child development centre.

N. Simons: Oh, so now you provide social service or supports to…?

M. Hemmy: We provide a spectrum of services from zero to 99, essentially, yes.

N. Simons: Zero to 99. Okay.

I’m interested…. You were talking about the support for free enterprise, etc. Then you wondered where government was to…. What exactly were you saying government should do?

M. Hemmy: Well, I have had a lot of interesting discussions since I initially wrote this. I wrote a perceived…. It’s a perception, from where I sit. It went a little bit confounding to some of us, so we’ve had a number of recruitment and retention community conversations in the last few weeks.

We’re finding that where we’re unable to grasp where planning has taken place is that the mandate of LNG Canada is to hire local, which is great for the individuals living in the community. But what happens is you take that population that is currently living in the community, move them onto the project, and you then create what I’m calling this black hole of jobs in the community that, yes, absolutely can be backfilled, but we now have a glut when it comes to the housing market.

These jobs are traditionally not the $35- to $40-an-hour jobs. They are the $13.85 to, let’s say, $20 an hour. These individuals cannot support a rent of $2,500 to $3,500 a month, because our rental prices…. Our housing market now reflects essentially what it looks like down in Vancouver.

R. Leonard: Thanks for coming out so early this morning. It sounds like you’re expressing that this town is a victim of its own success in that you’ve got a big project coming and people are getting opportunities that they didn’t have before.

M. Hemmy: Oh, absolutely.

R. Leonard: Just to share with you that how you describe the housing crunch exists in communities throughout British Columbia. However, your particular issue is compounded by your success story.

[8:30 a.m.]

I’m curious about the services that you need in this community, that you would like to see expanded to deal with your success.

M. Hemmy: The big challenge for the front-line workers that support our homeless prevention and our housing resource is the access to…. One would be a year-round shelter.

R. Leonard: So a shelter?

M. Hemmy: A shelter would be good. We do have an emergency response shelter for the winter. From about October 15 to March 31 roughly, we have four beds.

R. Leonard: Four beds?

M. Hemmy: That’s it for our shelter. They have to be out at seven o’clock in the morning. A 24-hour-a-day year-round shelter right now would help relieve some of the stress and some low-income housing to support those individuals who do want to come into town.

I appreciate that this is really…. I am speaking on behalf of the individuals who work front line, who are feeling the effects and the pressures of the people who are trying to source some housing and trying to potentially find a job in Kitimat.

I know Prince Rupert is suffering exactly the same challenges that we are. I’ve had some dialogues with them in the last couple of weeks as well. So I know we’re not unique.

R. Leonard: Do you have a sense of the scale of it? Is it dozens, hundreds? How big is the need in terms of housing? Do you have a sense of that yet?

M. Hemmy: I can only speak to the numbers that come through our doors for the housing resource program, and there’s a large transient population right now. We’re looking at probably in the neighbourhood of between 80 to 150 individuals.

B. D’Eith (Chair): There are similar experiences. Like Whistler, for example, gets a similar kind of thing with the employees there, because people go up to…. There’s all this high-end accommodation for people using Whistler. But what about all the people working there? They always run into that. And then the same….

I remember we were up, I think, at Williams Lake after the fires, and they didn’t have any…. Because a lot of people evacuated but never came back. It’s sort of like these unintended consequences that happen, and you’re pointing out a consequence of the project. We really appreciate that.

That’s why we come to different communities. You only learn these things sometimes when you’re face to face with people in the local communities. That’s why this committee goes all over the province. You can’t always make decisions out of Victoria or Vancouver or Prince George or whatever. We really appreciate you giving us your perspective on this.

Any other questions? I think we’re good.

Thank you very much for your time. I appreciate it.

We’re just waiting for the next…. A short recess.

The committee recessed from 8:33 a.m. to 8:34 a.m.

[B. D’Eith in the chair.]

B. D’Eith (Chair): Okay. We’re back with the Select Standing Committee on Finance and Government Services.

Next up I’d like to call city of Terrace — Mayor Carol Leclerc.

[8:35 a.m.]

CITY OF TERRACE

C. Leclerc: I just want to say that Terrace is named Terrace because we have platforms in our community. What happened is that last December Heather and I had gone down to meet with people from the Ministry of Finance. You had some funding that came out from the government. It was 50 percent federal money, 40 percent provincial money, 10 percent municipal money.

We put in for a grant because we needed to get from the bottom of Terrace to the upper end of Terrace. We are being impacted by LNG Canada. There’s this growth that’s gone absolutely nuts in our community. We used to have one, two, three housing starts a year. Then we’d get up to ten. I don’t know. Right now we’re at about 250.

We’ve done a transportation master plan. It says here…. This yellow line here is an indication of Lanfear Hill. That takes you from downtown — what we call the Horseshoe — up to the bench. We know that it’s a $10 million project to get that done. We wanted the 50 percent from the feds, the 40 percent from the province and the 10 percent from the municipality.

We went down. We said: “We don’t even have 10 percent.” We were ecstatic, in February, to get $8.2 million, part of that northern capital money that came through. We were doing our budget meeting in April. I said to our CAO, Heather Avison: “When are we going to hear about that grant that we put in for?” She said that they postponed it. I don’t know how you guys…. If you have any commitment in that, any kind of role in that….

We’re hurting. Our whole budget is $23 million for the entire city of Terrace, for 12,500 people. We don’t have $10 million in our budget even to plan, to go and borrow, to do Lanfear Hill. That’s just one of the hills that goes up. That was our priority hill. We have another hill that we also need to redo, but we’re hurting — big-time hurting.

The money, that grant money, is key to us. When we got the $8.2 million out of the northern capital money, and Minister Selina Robinson phoned to tell me about it, I said to her: “We’ve had one grant for $4 million — ever.” That was our very biggest grant ever. To get $8.2 million to go towards infrastructure was huge. Now to have this thing kicked down the road is tough.

We had a grade 9 class come and talk to us last week. They’re talking to us about biking, because they don’t feel safe. They say they don’t want to go down Lanfear Hill. They will travel all the way across the bench, back down another hill, and come to their high school before they will come down Lanfear Hill. It’s a priority in our community.

Questions?

B. D’Eith (Chair): Okay. I’ll do that. I know, Mayor, you’re used to that.

I saw a few hands. So Ronna-Rae and then Rich.

R. Leonard: Thank you for your presentation.

C. Leclerc: Does that make sense? That’s what I want to know.

R. Leonard: I was just going to say that the one word that I missed when somebody was moving a chair as you began speaking…. Is the infrastructure funding that you’re looking for, for roads, or is it sewer, water? Is this an already developed area that just needs rejigging?

C. Leclerc: It’s roads. It’s the growing area of our community, lots of potential subdivisions that are now becoming subdivisions. Coast Mountain College is up in that area. We have lots of farmland. There are schools up there.

It’s the only area left in Terrace, really, to grow. We’re feeling impacts. A couple of years ago, the citizens who live up there came, and they were quite concerned about subdivisions they were hearing about. They were like: “We don’t feel that that road is stable enough.” Of course, we’ve done our transportation master plan. We had the Premier, when he came up to deliver the $8.2 million news to us — $100 million — go down that road. He said: “I don’t know how you guys are going to redo that road.”

We have to redo that road. There aren’t a lot of options. There are three roads that get you up on to the bench area.

R. Leonard: Just out of curiosity, what was the $8.2 million for?

C. Leclerc: That was the northern capital and planning grant.

R. Leonard: What did you do with it?

C. Leclerc: That’s infrastructure. We want to grow that money. We only got it in February. We are very careful on how we are going to spend that. I don’t want to just go and put….

R. Leonard: So it’s not tagged for anything.

C. Leclerc: It’s tagged for infrastructure and planning. But that won’t cover that one road. If we were to use $1 million out of that $8 million, we’d still have other dollars to put into infrastructure.

[8:40 a.m.]

We have been part of the neglected part of the province for a number of years. We have got more kinds of studies done, ready to go, but no money. We want grant money. We want to take…. If we could use $1 million and tap into $10 million, that’s exactly what we want to do.

We’re hurting socially. You’re going to hear from my colleagues here on the impacts, the housing. We are putting city money into land for housing projects instead of doing water and sewer and roads and recreation — the stuff that municipalities are supposed to be doing.

R. Coleman: Carol, thank you. Let me try and get this clear. You’ve got the $8.2 million.

C. Leclerc: Yes.

R. Coleman: So what was pulled back? You said something was pulled back.

C. Leclerc: The grant money. The Canadian infrastructure….

A Voice: Investing in Canada infrastructure program.

B. D’Eith (Chair): So it’s federal.

R. Coleman: Is it federal money?

C. Leclerc: It’s 50 percent federal, 40 percent provincial and 10 percent municipal.

R. Coleman: The 50 percent was offered up and then put on hold?

C. Leclerc: We put in our grant application. We had the province working with us on this, and then it’s been delayed until after the federal election.

R. Coleman: It’s the federal delay, not the provincial delay.

C. Leclerc: I don’t know if you guys have any influence on that. We’re kind of getting a little nudge. “Your grant doesn’t look like it’s strong enough.” It’s like: “Well, frig. If it’s not strong enough, what are we going to do? What are we going to do?”

R. Coleman: You want some feedback as to how you make it better or whatever. You’d just like to have some clarity and know when, right?

C. Leclerc: We need to get that hill rebuilt if we’re getting all this impact from the growth that’s going to happen, and I think LNG’s just the starting point of that.

B. D’Eith (Chair): The provincial money is still on the table. It’s the federal money that’s not. Is that what you’re saying?

C. Leclerc: We don’t even know if the provincial money is there. We have no clue of anything.

R. Coleman: At this point, on those grants, you’re not sure on either. But it’s the federal one that’s definitely been delayed.

C. Leclerc: It’s a package deal. It’s 50 percent, 40 percent and 10 percent. And we haven’t even heard on the 40 percent provincial.

R. Coleman: Well, the 40 can’t move without the 50, right? Okay. Thank you.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Any other questions?

Well, thank you very much for your presentation.

C. Leclerc: Can I say one more thing?

B. D’Eith (Chair): Yes, of course.

C. Leclerc: Thank you for the Mills Memorial Hospital replacement — $450 million.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Nice.

C. Leclerc: Okay.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Thank you very much.

Next up we have Sean Bujtas.

All right. Thanks, Sean. If we could try and keep the comments to about five minutes, that allows us to have questions.

S. Bujtas: I will not breach five minutes. If you give me two seconds….

SEAN BUJTAS

S. Bujtas: Morning, everybody. Terrace is the regional service centre through which most of the economic activity in the northwest B.C. flows. Situated as it is, it is the crossroad of a major east-west, north-south transportation corridor. With a population of 11,643 according to the 2019 census, Terrace represents a third of the population of the regional district of Kitimat-Stikine, which increases to 50 percent when adjacent unincorporated rural areas are included.

Terrace is just a 40-minute drive from Kitimat and is already home to many people and businesses that support the major Rio Tinto aluminium refinery located in Kitimat. The Rio Tinto facility is currently the industrial property with the highest-assessed value in B.C., and it will be dwarfed by the LNG Canada facility, once complete. It is clear LNG Canada will have a significant impact on Terrace, but unlike Kitimat, LNG Canada will not provide any additional revenue to Terrace.

Terrace provides infrastructure in the form of policing, water, sewer, roads and hospital to industry outside our borders without the benefits of being able to tax them. As much as we appreciate the $8 million from the northern capital and planning grant, this is only a good start. The $8 million will not even cover the project, such as the rebuild of land that Her Worship was just speaking about.

Terrace has significant capital projects that we need to undertake but cannot afford in the current environment. That includes an infrastructure deficit related to maintaining current infrastructure and infrastructure improvements needed to make communities sustainable and livable. For example, Terrace has 80 kilometres of roads and rebuilds less than one kilometre a year. It has 100 kilometres of water main, replaces less than one kilometre a year and has 70 kilometres of sewer main with no ongoing replacement.

[8:45 a.m.]

In addition, Terrace needs the following projects but cannot afford them: fire and rescue, $7.5 million; downtown revitalization, $1 million; museum, $8 million; parks upgrade, $800,000; transportation, $38 million; sewer and water, $32 million. This general deficit will only be exaggerated by the extra pressures on our roads, hospital and other infrastructure that we can expect during construction of LNG Canada.

Terrace is a fiscally prudent municipality without the benefits of significant industrial plants that provide direct taxation, like Kitimat, or with the benefits of significant senior government grants like Fort St. John and Dawson Creek.

Dawson Creek has a population of 10,994 people, with an annual budget of almost $60 million, compared to Terrace, with a population of 11,643 and an annual budget of $23 million. Dawson Creek receives over $17 million annually from the province for the Peace River agreement. This is why Terrace has been a strong supporter of the Resource Benefits Alliance and hopes that the province will come to an agreement with the RBA.

Terrace makes the best use we can of the resources we have available but does not have the capacity to deal with the significant short-term impacts of projects like LNG Canada. It is very clear that Terrace also does not have the capacity to improve the livability and community to make it significantly more attractive to people working in the northwest.

We heard it over and over: the largest private sector investment in Canadian history, 40 kilometres away. But at this point, Terrace will not see any of the revenue. Terrace is in immediate need of funding and help to prepare the community for this megaproject.

Communities in B.C.’s northeast can chart their economic future based on the continued stability provided by the Peace River agreement. Terrace deserves this stability too and seeks ongoing revenue support, at least until the province and the Resource Benefits Alliance deal that is beneficial to all.

As Your Worship had pointed out, we struggle to pay for anything. When you look at the cities like Dawson Creek that are getting $17 million from the province, our budget is $23 million. It’s tough to make ends meet.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Thanks, Sean.

R. Coleman: I have a couple of questions. I noticed you named, appropriately, a road called Jack Talstra as I was coming down the highway today.

The vision that you had for the industrial land in and around the airport. How is that doing?

S. Bujtas: Slow.

R. Coleman: Slow, still?

S. Bujtas: Yeah.

R. Coleman: You’re getting some staging stuff there that I noticed.

S. Bujtas: They’re building a bit there, a little bit of infrastructure. But it’s definitely not moving at the pace we had hoped it would move at.

R. Leonard: Thanks for your presentation. I missed…. Are you affiliated with the city? Are you with the…?

S. Bujtas: I’m a councillor with the city of Terrace.

R. Leonard: You’re a city councillor. Okay. I was just wondering. Thank you.

B. D’Eith (Chair): As I was saying to an earlier presenter, that’s why the committee comes all over the province, because it’s very difficult to hear these kind of stories when you’re in Victoria or Vancouver. So we really appreciate you giving the local perspective of the impacts of something like a big project like LNG Canada. It’s important for the committee and for the government to hear that. So thanks a lot, Sean. Appreciate it.

S. Bujtas: I invite you to come take a drive in Terrace and take a look at Lanfear Hill. Two trucks are clipping window mirrors as they drive by.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Great. Thank you.

Next up we have Brian Downie.

BRIAN DOWNIE

B. Downie: Good morning. My name is Brian Downie. I’m a councillor with the city of Terrace. I appreciate the opportunity to speak with you, along with my colleagues.

I’d like to talk about the Terrace homeless crisis. I’ve spent some time writing it out because it is an emotional and sensitive issue, and I kind of want to be careful.

Terrace has a homeless count of about 100. On a per-capita basis, it’s amongst the highest in the province. Although the confidence in the count annually varies with the size of the sample, the weather and the ability of the survey to reach the homeless, the reality is a large number of people in Terrace are homeless.

Most of the homeless are Indigenous people who’ve come to Terrace from our neighbouring villages. In fact, frequent comments are received that these individuals are residents and had housing in those communities but chose to come to Terrace.

[8:50 a.m.]

In the homeless population, there is a high frequency of people with mental health and addictions. Within that population are individuals whose behaviour is problematic and who are adversely affecting other residents and businesses in our city. While the city is faced with this crisis, it appears that the city and the non-profits are alone in trying to find the solution, a made-in-Terrace solution. Mental health and addictions are clearly outside the mandate of the city of Terrace. Equally as clear, that mandate is in the purview of the provincial government. It is specifically that fact that we’re presenting to you today.

Housing for the homeless had made progress in the last five years. The rapid response to housing projects built by B.C. Housing and to be managed by Ksan House Society, built with city land…. That should be open within ten days or so. My compliments, first of all, to Rich and his ministry back in the day and then to the current government for completing that funding through B.C. Housing.

The other housing projects all require some level of city subsidy — land, grants or servicing agreements. In total, about 110 units of homeless and affordable housing will be available for occupancy this year. In the city, we are optimistic about how the availability will affect homelessness and the ability of our citizens and businesses to feel safe and comfortable in our downtown. Time will tell. We just don’t know.

Another aspect of homelessness is food services. Food services are available to the low-income and homeless in Terrace. In fact, we hear that that is a feature that attracts homeless to Terrace. We are concerned that more services will mean more homeless.

In the past few years, various initiatives have been put in place to address the impact of homelessness in Terrace, as well as housing. The city bylaw compliance officer and a recent assistant, with the support of the RCMP crime reduction unit, have worked effectively but at a high cost to the city taxpayer and have focused on behaviour in the downtown — specifically, liquor and loitering. The downtown improvement association has completed a pilot security project to reduce the impact of panhandling, loitering and aggressive behaviour. The success of that two-month program has been documented and has led the city and the TDIA to continue the program for another six months.

Northern Health has initiated an integrated case management team and provides some outreach services to those with mental health and addictions issues. A promising initiative, led by Kermode Friendship Society, has been their outreach and counselling on job skills for the homeless. Their success is documented and appears to be what is needed, providing one-on-one support and encouraging individuals to move away from being homeless.

Unfortunately, the promise of this initiative is threatened by the loss of funding — specifically, gaming funding, in this case — and has caused the layoff of key staff. They went through a pilot project, then hit a wall, and now are struggling with a partial program, when the results were there. If agencies in the city are to make headway on the homeless crisis, stable and sufficient funding and support are essential. Stability is probably the key word there. Starting and stopping is likely not going to be effective.

Our ask today is for the provincial social agencies to address their mandate and for programs such as Kermode Friendship Society to receive stable funding. Security and enforcement, whether that’s RCMP or bylaw officers, are costing the city dearly, with limited support from the province.

[8:55 a.m.]

Given that the safety net and the programs for the homeless are clearly a provincial responsibility, it is our hope that the province will step up and provide resources for critical on-the-ground support — that’s the outreach aspect, particularly — for the city and for the non-profits that work with the homeless.

Thank you for the opportunity.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Thanks, Brian. I just had to clarify something. You said that the homeless count is about 100, but you also said that there are about 110 units of supportive housing coming on line soon, in the next ten days. Could you clarify that for me?

B. Downie: The rapid response housing project is specifically a homeless housing project. There are 52 units there. Those will be open, I think, in about ten days. The other units are affordable housing units, at below-market-value rent. One has just opened, for about 45 units. Another 25 or so are in the last stages of being completed. We have made some headway on housing.

R. Coleman: Brian, a couple of questions. Have you, first of all, spoken to B.C. Housing about taking the shelter 24-7? I think the person before you said that it closes at seven in the morning. Have you looked into having it run 24-7 and talked to them about funding that?

B. Downie: In the rapid response?

C. Leclerc: No, in the shelters, the homeless shelters.

B. Downie: The Turning Point?

C. Leclerc: Yes.

R. Coleman: You said it closes at seven in the morning.

B. Downie: They’ve extended some programs there. I don’t think they’ve got the support.

R. Coleman: Okay. Well, you might pursue that, because most shelters in B.C. now are run 24-7 so that they don’t kick them out at seven o’clock in the morning. Then they connect in with the outreach workers, which I know you have in the community, and then try to connect in with mental health and other supports. But when they go out at 7 a.m., you lose that opportunity.

It might be a conversation you have. I’d start with B.C. Housing on that conversation, because they’re the ones that actually initiated that in most communities, for 24-7. I’m not familiar with the actual shelter facility in Terrace, but I suspect it might be able to handle it. If you don’t get any response, let us know.

B. Downie: Just on that point — this new homeless housing project, the rapid response to housing…. It’s unclear whether there’ll be mental health and addictions support in that facility. There’ll be 24-7 management in the building, but talking to Ksan, it’s kind of a wait-and-see how it plays out. It’s in close proximity to Northern Health’s Terrace Health Unit. There’s potential support there, but it’s to be….

R. Coleman: I think they’re a decent society that can help build those programs too — that they operate it.

N. Simons: Thank you for your presentation. I always try to connect the dots. You said the province needs to do more. I think 52 units of supportive housing with 24-7 staffing is going to have a big impact on the ability to reach the people who are, as you describe, creating problems for enforcement.

I would probably be correct in saying that the housing situation in the villages is not such that it makes for good options for housing. I think we’ve got a housing crisis, a living condition crisis, a water crisis — all sorts of those. When you say that people come to the larger communities even though they have housing options, I think that we just have to realize that people move for many, many reasons.

The goal is to have the supports necessary, wherever in British Columbia. We’re not trying to pit communities against communities. I do think — and I hope you anticipate — that some of the social service agencies are going to benefit, in being able to reach their clients more effectively when they have a stable place to live. They’ll be able to take opportunities to improve their lives as they can if they have a safe place to live. I’m really glad that that’s happening.

I represent rural communities. We have this suspicion that people are going to move to our communities because they’re beautiful and because there are services available. Every community fears that, but I think, ultimately, we all have that responsibility to try and address the crisis that has grown over a number of years.

[9:00 a.m.]

I think that your advocacy is going to help make sure that we stay on that and continue not to think that it’s done now. We’ve got lots of continued work, and I thank you for your advocacy.

M. Dean: Thank you for bringing the matter to the attention of the committee. My question is: have you considered modular housing? Modular housing comes with those wraparound services.

Interjection.

M. Dean: Is that what the 52 is?

Interjection.

M. Dean: Okay. Are you able to expand those? Have you asked for more? How did you arrive at the number of 52?

B. Downie: The 52 units are just opening. We don’t have residents in there yet. Within a short time, we will, and then we’ll have to measure the effect on the street — how that affects people.

Right now we have a fairly significant tent camp. If you are in Terrace near Walmart, there’s a vacant area. It’s there, and it’s on private land. It seems to be meeting a need, although obviously unauthorized.

Housing is one aspect of this issue, and it’s an important part, no question. But the other aspect is dealing with people, individuals. I was interested in the Kermode Friendship approach. I think the case management team from Northern Health has got some potential, but it’s dealing with individuals, with their mental health, addictions, trauma, the cultural issues. I think that’s where we’re going to make some headway with a part of that hundred people. Some we may not, but for sure, that’s where the non-profits need support.

R. Leonard: Thank you very much for your presentation. Some of what you’ve been saying echoes in my community. We just opened 48 units of the supportive modular housing, and it has made a difference on our streets, so you can look forward to some success, I’m sure. It’s one of those proven models that helps people move beyond their present circumstances.

I want to congratulate you for partnering with the province to bring that housing to your community. You said it was on city-owned land that it’s being built, as it was in my community, too. We can’t move forward without those kinds of partnerships.

You made a comment about something that attracts people to Terrace. It’s the food services. I’m just wondering if you know what kinds of programs there are for food security, not just in Terrace but in the surrounding areas. Is this something that the province should be paying attention to, in terms of food security that helps people stay in their home communities?

B. Downie: I think the general feeling is that with the Salvation Army, with the Terrace and District Community Services soup kitchen, with the shelters and what they provide, with the food banks, there are a lot of resources there. But the comment we get — and this is all anecdotal — is that it’s actually attracting people.

R. Leonard: Well, if anybody’s hungry, they’re going to come where there’s food, right?

B. Downie: You can come to Terrace and be fed seven days a week. I mean, it’s anecdotal. So you have to take it for what it’s worth.

Our concern is that as you provide more facilities, unless you’re dealing with the root causes, there’s a gap there. So it seems like we need to get on with the hard work. It’s actually one-on-one counselling, dealing with the cultural issues, getting people back to work.

R. Leonard: You just mentioned one other thing that I was interested in, because our government has increased the funding for friendship centres — for secure, permanent funding. I don’t know if this is something that is still coming for the Kermode Friendship Centre. But to identify this particular program is good to hear. Thank you.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Brian, thank you very much for your presentation. We really appreciate it.

Okay, recess.

The committee recessed from 9:05 a.m. to 9:19 a.m.

[B. D’Eith in the chair.]

B. D’Eith (Chair): Next up I’d like to invite Rob Goffinet.

[9:20 a.m.]

All right. If we could try to keep the initial comments to about five minutes, that would be great. Thanks, Rob.

ROB GOFFINET

R. Goffinet: Absolutely. I hope so.

Thank you. My name is Rob Goffinet. Although I sit as a municipal councillor, I’m just sitting in listening. I did not plan to speak, but I’ve heard several things. If I can, just as a civilian, put a few things into perspective. I really appreciate what you’re doing. This is very important.

You’ve probably heard a lot from non-profits. I, as a public local politician, do too. One of the things that really is stressing people out in the service sector and non-profits, I think, is the whole concept of dependable year-to-year funding. I don’t know what you can do about it, but it is something I, as a civilian, hear all the time — dependable, year-to-year funding, where everyone can do their work and plan ahead.

I’ve heard this morning, and I totally agree, that B.C. Housing, the Ministry of Housing, is doing real, important work in Kitimat. It’s noticeable, and I believe it’s appreciated in the community. B.C. Housing, you took over a motel, and for the first time in Kitimat, you have supported, focused housing in Kitimat. It’s called Douglas Place. If you’re downtown, it’s an old motel right in the core. A success story, I think. You have supported, now, three housing support workers that are doing excellent work, 24-7.

The boom that we have, you’re hearing, has got unintended negative consequences. I think, Ronna, you mentioned something about the blessing of the bounty. Yes, it’s a blessing, but there are unintended consequences. Thank you for supporting supported-housing workers in Kitimat.

Tamitik Status of Women. The Housing Ministry, as well, for the first time put targeted funding — it’s probably 30 to 40 units — for this Tamitik Status of Women’s focus on supportive anti-violence accommodation and long-term stability for women and children, and some men, to get out of abusive relationships. That is a success story in Kitimat. The community is really looking forward to it. It is about to break ground just off the downtown area any day now.

Something, as well — the Advanced Education, Skills and Training Ministry. I don’t know if you know or have any control over NVIT, Nicola Valley Institute of Technology, a First Nations innovative, on-the-front-line training institute allied with BCIT. Our local First Nations in partnership with the major industries in Kitimat is called Kitimat Valley Institute.

There are talks going for the Nicola Valley Institute in the south, as a premiere Aboriginal training institute, with BCIT, being funded to expand the Kitimat Valley Institute campus for training of First Nations and other community people in the northwest.

[9:25 a.m.]

If you ever have queries about the support of that initiative, I think it would revolutionize training in the north. It would back up and integrate with Coast Mountains school district in an innovative way with First Nations training.

Mills Memorial. I would amplify what Mayor Leclerc said from Terrace. That is a wonderful, hoped-for initiative of the province — the Mills Memorial rebuild. But with that, please, the future funding of Northern Health…. With the boom comes mental health and other stressors that Northern Health is attempting to respond to.

In your deliberations, the entire Northern Health bud­get…. I know you’re putting a lot of money into Mills Memorial. It will be wonderful. But the satellite hospitals, the brand-new — brand-new; it’s 18 or 19 years old — Kitimat General Hospital…. We do, with respect, worry. The huge amount of investment 60 kilometres away in Terrace is good as long as you understand that funding cannot be denied to other jurisdictions only 60 kilometres away — Kitimat General Hospital.

We have two operating rooms. The orthopedic surgery for the northwest is centred here and in Prince Rupert. That simple fact keeps a fully functioning, full-service hospital in Kitimat, only 60 kilometres away from Terrace, that will be almost so big and so attractive for practitioners and recruitment. The problem is you can’t deny the ancillary feeder hospitals that are extremely important on the periphery of the new Mills. That’s a success story as well.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Rob, we’re at about seven minutes now. So we’re kind of over time for the initial, but there’s still room for questions.

Are there any questions for Rob at all?

You have a couple more minutes. If you wanted to say anything else, please do.

R. Goffinet: The thing is special needs. In your deliberation, you have to realize that yes, we’re getting all kinds of tax revenue. Yes, we’re the centre of attention. But in simple and heartbreaking ways, stressors, mental health issues and family breakup come hand in hand with that.

We’re not panicking. It’s a great place. This will work. We’re looking forward to LNG and the development, but we are trying to cope with the simple unintended stressors that come with a wonderful and a huge opportunity.

I thank you. It’s lovely talking to you. I did it a year or two ago. I appreciate your work and your visiting our community. God bless.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Sorry. Before you go, Mitzi had a little thing.

M. Dean: Yeah, I had a question. Sorry. Have you had conversations with LNG Canada about their plans around industrial work camps and making sure that women in the community and the surrounding areas are protected?

R. Goffinet: Women are protected? Yes. Most of the discussion has been on health care — the isolation of the workers so they do not impinge upon services in town. Tamitik Status of Women, which I think may be presenting a little later…. I believe that, yes, they have had discussions.

One of the reasons why the Tamitik Status of Women project, the shelter, has been funded is…. There is no problem, but in case there is a dynamic problem, with thousands of people coming into town, on family life, that facility and centralization of all the Tamitik Status of Women programs in one place will help.

[9:30 a.m.]

No, we haven’t noticed anything, but I’m going to stick around and listen to what The Tamitik Status of Women maybe tell you.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Great. Thank you so much, Rob. Appreciate it.

Next up we have Dave Johnston from The North Matters.

Hi, Dave. How are you?

J. Borgens: I’m great. I’m not Dave. I’m Jon Borgens.

B. D’Eith (Chair): But you are with The North Matters?

J. Borgens: I am with The North Matters. Hence, the nerves. I was kind of thrown into this.

B. D’Eith (Chair): It’s fine. If we could keep the initial comments to about five minutes, that would be great.

THE NORTH MATTERS

J. Borgens: It will be under that, not a problem. As I said, I’m quite nervous to be here. But if we do what we’ve always done, we’ll get what we always get.

My name is Jon Borgens. I’m here today on behalf of a small group known as The North Matters. We were founded a few years ago here in Kitimat by a group of diverse, dedicated locals who wanted to help fight for opportunities for people in B.C.’s north. Our group is small but determined and does whatever we can to fulfil our mission statement of building strength in northern communities while aligning and creating opportunities for its resi­dents.

Since formed, our group has made some great traction and become known as champions of the resource sector. We’ve done this with little to no budget, spending our own personal funds and asking local small business for help. This truly is a grassroots organization by the people, for the people.

Kitimat and the entire northwest sit on the precipice of almost unimaginable change. I’m sure each of you saw the press conference last October stating that LNG Canada will be the largest, single private investment in the history of our country. What does that mean? That means our country has never undertaken something like this. It means that we’ll need the help and support of our municipal, provincial and federal governments like never before.

The sheer size of this opportunity — please remember that this is not the only one proposed for our region — has the ability to bring new prosperity to thousands of Canadians and has the ability to have significant impact on global climate change and the potential to bring our country to the world forefront of the blossoming LNG sector.

Personally, I work for a large Fortune 500 company that set up here in Kitimat to become part of this incredible location. For the past seven years, in every report I’ve made to my boards and leadership, I’ve stated that to truly benefit from this opportunity, we will have to think like we’ve never thought, do like we’ve never done and act like we’ve never acted.

My report to you is no different. We as B.C.’ers must consistently re-evaluate, reassess and revisit all aspects of this region and ensure that we are working together to not only better this place but ensure that the rest of the province, the rest of the country and the rest of the world will, in fact, benefit from what is about to happen here.

Current population of the greater Vancouver area is 2.5 million people. Imagine for a moment that this area swells to five million people within the next 12 to 18 months; greater Victoria from 350,000 to say 700,000. What does that look like? Can any of us actually honestly say right now what we’ll need for that to happen?

This is what we’re in for in this region. Our population in Kitimat currently sits at about 8,000. We’re expecting 7,000 to 10,000 more people into the region to help build this facility. Again, please remember, this is not the only one.

Health care spending in the area is required. We need doctors, nurses and upgrades to our facilities. Some of these have already been addressed like the new Mills Memorial in Terrace, which should definitely help ease some of the burden, but more will be needed.

Education spending is also required. Again, money is being set aside for training and development programs and opportunities for people in the region. Government is partnering with business in helping to prepare for labour demand in the area, but more will be needed.

Infrastructure is truly where I see our biggest need. There are many infrastructure projects that have been looked at and proposed over the years, some gaining traction, some not as much. The Haisla Bridge being the first one that pops into my head.

However, one thing that I’ve not seen much discussion about is looking at the upgrades to the road between Kitimat and Kitamaat Village. People often say that Kitimat is at the end of the road. I guess that means Kitamaat Village is at the end of the road past the end of the road.

Many times since I’ve lived here, this road has been cut off and people stranded on either side for a host of different reasons, be it snowstorms, windstorms, flooding or terrible accidents. To me, this is unbelievable.

[9:35 a.m.]

People being cut off from their homes, from their families and their jobs certainly happens but rarely with this kind of frequency. There’s been a marked increase in traffic along this road as the Kitamaat Village supports the LNG industry through the MK Bay Marina and various other projects in their area. This road grants people of the region access to hiking trails and some of our only access to the ocean in our region. These upgrades will only increase public access and provide even more reasons for people to bring their families to this region and settle here.

The Haisla are an incredible people and are being held up around the province as a shining example of First Nations pride, business acumen and their ability and willingness to engage with big business. The Haisla leadership have been incredibly strong for years, with the current chief councillor, Crystal Smith, and her predecessor, MLA Ellis Ross, leading the charge. The Haisla are not afraid to do what they feel will benefit not only their children and their children’s children but all people from the region. With their entrepreneurship and the province committing to help create better access to their location, I feel as though we will all benefit.

The Haisla are a leader amongst First Nations of this country. Let the B.C. government also be leaders in helping to foster and nurture a vibrant community, doing everything they can to lift this entire region from some pretty dark days.

I wasn’t going to include this, but I’m going to. This is a slide that my company has been, sort of, sending around. It’s very simple. It’s just a picture of British Columbia. It says: “Mission possible.” What I found interesting about this…. It’s very basic. It’s very simple. But strategically, the spark is in the Kitimat area, and I found that very poignant in the fact that this area has the ability to set off things that we’ve never seen in this country, and we need the help of the government to do so.

The specific I had was the road to Haisla village, but there’s more that will come, and we don’t know them yet. Together, we must all think like we’ve never thought, do like we’ve never done and act like we’ve never acted. That’s all I have.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Great. Thank you very much, Jon.

Any questions for Jon?

R. Leonard: Thank you for your presentation. Do you know…? Is there an economic development society in the Kitimat area?

J. Borgens: Yep. There’s Kitimat Economic Development Association, and we have the economic development office in the district itself.

R. Leonard: Do you relate with them at all?

J. Borgens: As my group? Yes, I do. We sort of mix and mingle with anybody that’s fighting for opportunities in this area. So yes, we are connected.

R. Leonard: Okay. Thank you.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Okay. Well, thank you very much, Jon. Appreciate it.

J. Borgens: Thank you for your time.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Michelle Martins from Tamitik Status of Women.

Michelle, we’re just going to take a short recess, if that’s okay.

M. Martins: Sure. Yeah. No problem.

The committee recessed from 9:38 a.m. to 9:40 a.m.

[B. D’Eith in the chair.]

B. D’Eith (Chair): All right. Michelle Martins. If we could try and keep the initial comments to about five minutes, then we have time for questions. That would be great.

Thanks, Michelle.

TAMITIK STATUS OF WOMEN

M. Martins: My name is Michelle Martins. I am the director of services for Tamitik Status of Women. We have been operating for over 40 years in the community. Our mission statement is: “We are committed to promoting a healthy community by offering ongoing support, programs, education and opportunities while prioritizing equality and safety.”

We run 16 different programs out of six different locations. All of our programming is free to the public. Currently most of our funding comes from various places within the province, as well as partnerships locally and interprovincially.

We’ve experienced exponential growth since 2012. How­ever, we also experienced the highest demand for service during the Kitimat modernization project, as well as the highest worker turnover. Because of our experiences with our last industrial boom, we know the demand will be even greater as LNG Canada’s project ramps up.

It’s hard for us to strategize for recruitment and retention of workers during these industrial booms because our programs have minimal or no core funding, so we can’t compete with industry wages, not to mention how emotionally difficult and heart-heavy our work is. Most of our programs and positions are part-time.

I’d like to explain three significant challenges that we are currently facing and that we expect to be exacerbated as the industrial boom increases.

Firstly, the development of LNG will create a marked increase in service, particularly housing. The high wages may benefit some, but it will also exaggerate the inequity and make it difficult for us to retain staff. We already experienced this during KMP. We’ve also done research that looks at women’s and girls’ experiences, and they noted housing as an issue. To address this challenge, we need more core funding to create stable jobs with decent wages.

Another problem we face — it’s ongoing — is the severity of housing. We do believe that we are experiencing a housing crisis in Kitimat, and we do believe the shortage will become greater as the project increases. Housing is a critical issue, as well as food security, and the research we’ve done shows that our clientele rely on a range of services to have their daily needs met.

Just to give you a bit of an example of what we see in the community. We currently operate a transition house. We are funded for eight beds, but we have ten. So when I say that we are full, that means that all ten beds are being used, and we are actually running over capacity. For instance, during 2014, which was the height of the KMP project, we were full or over capacity for 202 nights out of that year. Last year, in total, we turned away 66 women and 57 children that we could not accommodate. Last month we were full every night and ran out of capacity of 108 percent.

We do have a rental assistance program that is funded through B.C. Housing. Each month they give us $6,750 to disperse. The maximum we can give to each client is $450, so essentially, it’s meant to help 15 individuals per month. We help over 30 individuals each month, on average. We rarely give out the maximum so that we can meet the needs of many rather than a few. That program started in the tail end of 2014, and we’re already seeing that that’s not sufficient to meet the needs of our clientele to stay housed in the community.

I’d also just like to point out that our clientele, for the most part, are long-term, low-income or fixed-income individuals who are now finding it difficult to live in the community. Because there’s a lack of long-term, affordable housing for women, children and youth following a shelter stay, that can result in an increased risk of homelessness, as well as living in unsafe conditions or returning to an abuser.

The research we did. We partnered with Haisla Nation and the University of Guelph in 2016, and we created a community vitality index. We met with 130 women aged 14 and up where we asked them to define “well-being” and what factors contributed to detract from their well-being.

[9:45 a.m.]

The cost of living was a major dividing factor in women’s experiences. Women who have access to sufficient economic resources may not understand the extent of the challenges faced by women who live without the comfort of being able to meet their daily needs.

The high cost of living in Kitimat means that a lot of families go without access to sport teams and clubs in the community, and that creates a social disconnection. Many women in Kitimat described a strong social network of social services that help to create minimal food security for people. But this should also raise the question of why so many women in our community struggle to gain access to good food.

Another challenge that I believe is interwoven in what we’re experiencing is the lack of systemic attention given to the complex experiences of the diverse women and girls in our community. For instance, we know from our expertise as front-line service providers that Indigenous women are uniquely affected by the persistence of colonialism, as well as members of the LGBTQ community. Those who are disabled have unique needs that are not necessarily met in Kitimat.

We were encouraged by the province’s introduction of a Parliamentary Secretary for Gender Equity and the environmental assessment revitalization, which commits to including gender-based analysis. To address these challenges further, we believe that the province should support local data-gathering initiatives, so we have better access to information about the diverse needs and experiences of women in the northern communities, as well as collaborate with northern residents and service providers who can inform the development for tools of undertaking things that are contextually relevant.

That’s it for me.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Great. Thank you very much, Michelle.

M. Dean: Thank you for all of your work. Thank you for coming and presenting. It’s really important for us to hear from you and who you’re representing, as well.

I’m really interested in discussions with LNG Canada. They’ve set high standards for making sure that women in the communities impacted by the project are safe and protected, not just in work camps but in the surrounding communities. I’d be really interested in hearing whether they’ve had conversations with you, whether they’re bringing some resources and actually stepping up to meet those standards.

M. Martins: Sure, if I may. We actually have a really good relationship with the representatives from LNG Canada in our community. However, that’s just one piece of the puzzle.

For instance, I really commend LNG Canada that they will not do living-out allowances, which we believe contributed to the rental increases during the Kitimat modernization project. Even though they have been adamant and public about not giving their workers living-out allowances, that their workers will be in camps, that doesn’t deter landlords from raising those rents and also keeping furnished apartments vacant rather than renting at a lower rate for our lower- or fixed-income clients.

Our concerns with the project are not meant to throw LNG Canada under the bus. I think that they are socially aware, and we certainly do have good partnerships with them. But it’s how their project affects the community in a larger scale.

I think that kind of goes back to the Kitimat modernization project, where that was the first industrial boom in a very long time in Kitimat. Even before LNG Canada gave their positive FID, for instance, landlords were still holding onto those apartments vacant, and they were still keeping those rents high, even during an industrial lull, in anticipation of the project.

B. D’Eith (Chair): I think part of it, too — and I’m not sure, Mitzi, if the question got answered — just in terms of one of the key needs in trades, is to get women in trades. I know LNG Canada seems committed to bringing women in trades.

I think part of it, though, too, is the safety of women in the camps and also in the local community. I’m not sure if that’s also what you we’re asking.

M. Dean: Yeah. Thanks, Bob.

B. D’Eith (Chair): If you wouldn’t mind, have you actually talked to them about the safety of women in those situations in the camps and also locally?

M. Martins: Yes. Actually, as part of our community vitality index, that committee still meets, and we have some action items that have come out since, following the report we did in 2016.

[9:50 a.m.]

Part of those action items is to collaborate with LNG Canada to make sure that the perspectives of women and, particularly, Indigenous women in the community are being heard. As many of the women noted, feeling unsafe during KMP, either on the worksite or in the community….

I’d also like to note that during the last boom, we did see an increase in service. I think there’s a misconception. There is a correlation between violence against women and large industrial projects. But I think, in this community, there is a misconception that that violence was occurring from camp workers.

We found that the women fleeing violence…. It was usually local women fleeing local abusers. It wasn’t so much that the camp workers were abusive but rather that the work, the increased industrial work here, was exacerbating the plights of the people who are already struggling in our community — creating conflict within families, that sort of thing — rather than being assaulted by strangers.

The other thing…. Again, I do think LNG Canada is making an effort to diversify their workforce and include women in the industrial sector, which is great, because Kitimat is predominantly a male community. There’s three men for every woman. There actually used to be seven men for every woman, when Kitimat was first established. But child care is also a persistent barrier for women to enter any sort of workforce.

That continues to be an issue here. We don’t have…. I’m sure you heard from Marianne Hemmy this morning. There’s the will here to have more robust child care services, but we don’t have the qualified workforce to support that.

R. Leonard: Thank you for your presentation. You helped better clarify for me, a little bit, the impact of higher wages from the industry impacting social services. It’s more about, if I’m getting you correctly, the impact to the economy. So a jug of milk is going to cost more because there are higher wages.

Do you have an index now where you can judge food costs and housing costs against income? You’ve talked about the KMP. That sounds like almost a dip in the waters of seeing a boom economy for a while and the impacts to the community.

M. Martins: Right. KMP is certainly just a fraction of what we are anticipating with LNG Canada. We don’t have any sort of…. We didn’t keep track of any sorts of inflation costs, in terms of the cost of living.

The Kitimat Community Development Centre, formerly the child development centre, during KMP, actually did a cost-of-living report. I believe, during that time, the minimum that somebody would need to live above the poverty line was $20.63. So even for us, many of our workers don’t make that wage, and that goes with other non-profits in the community.

For us, because we can’t compete with industry wages, our workforce is primarily rooted in people who have the compassion to do that work. You could say, in a way, that we kind of exploit that compassion, because we don’t really have any monetary incentives to give our workforce, particularly given how heart-heavy the work is, the emotional toll that can happen to our workforce.

What we did see when we did our own research with the community vitality index is…. We didn’t just hear about…. Certainly, because it was during the time of KMP, that was a predominant part of the discussions. But we did hear from all sorts…. People talked about all sorts of accounts that happened in the history of Kitimat, including the closure of our pulp mill, the Eurocan pulp mill.

For those who are considered middle- or high-income earners, when Eurocan shut down, that was devastating for them. Their houses lost value, that sort of thing. But for those individuals who were low or fixed income, that was the first time ever that they potentially could buy a house in Kitimat. For them, because of that closure and people leaving the community, their experiences were actually lifted rather than trying to compete with high-income earners. Kitimat has one of the highest incomes across the province because of Rio Tinto, because of the aluminum smelter.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Great. Well, thank you very much, Michelle. Appreciate your presentation and your perspec­tive. It’s really wonderful to hear that.

[9:55 a.m.]

M. Martins: Thank you for your time.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Next up we have the Gingolx Village Government. I believe George Moore is speaking, but I did want to recognize Claude Barton, Steven Doolan, John Moore, Gwen Nelson and Henry Stephens.

George, thanks for presenting. It’s nice to have so many people on the panels. It’s great. If we could try to keep the initial comments to about five minutes, we’d appreciate that. Then we have time for questions.

The floor is yours, George.

GINGOLX VILLAGE GOVERNMENT

G. Moore: Thank you. Good morning. George Moore, chief councillor of the Nisg̱a’a village of Gingolx. It’s good for us to be here and to have a discussion this morning with some of our treaty partners. Gingolx is one of the four communities that are represented with the Nisg̱a’a treaty.

Our presentation this morning covers seven items, so we’ll get right to it. If you have your document with you, we’re going to begin on page 2 with housing.

My community is located 240 kilometres away from Kitimat, so 179 kilometres from Terrace. We appreciate the opportunity to be here. We are one of four Nisg̱a’a communities within the final agreement, and we’re pleased to have the opportunity to present the following brief about who the village of Gingolx are, where we live and what’s important to our community. The document highlights seven items that members of the Legislative Assembly need to be aware of as we meet with you and hear our community’s needs with regard to Budget 2020.

The first item is housing. In Gingolx, housing is a challenge. In the last 20 years, very little new money has been available for new housing. It’s estimated that the creation of 40 new homes is what’s needed just to catch up. That refers to a physical development document that was provided in 1997, with an in-migration statistic of 33 percent over ten years.

My community right now consists of 142 residential units, 372 individual citizens residing in my community right now. We are a total citizenship base of 2,012, and we want to be able to welcome every one of those citizens from all of the urban communities within the province to come home. To do that, 40 new homes are what’s needed just to catch up to that plan.

Due to the lack of funding, Gingolx has struggled with a housing shortage. This puts existing older houses in disrepair, and new needs are not met. Those that wish to move back to the community cannot, because they have no place to stay.

We’ve looked at a subdivision — probably, now, at least 12 years ago. It was called the Westridge subdivision. It’s 350 lots that would be constructed. Right now my community is at ground level, sea level. It’s located on an alluvial fan so that, if there’s ever an earthquake in our community, liquefaction becomes a very big concern.

[10:00 a.m.]

Our second item is B.C. Hydro’s very high rates. I’ll give you a quick example. My last payment to B.C. Hydro for three months was $962 for my house. I don’t know what is average, but I’m told it’s at least a third in the city of Terrace that they pay, compared to what my community members are paying.

B.C. Hydro rates in our community are estimated at three times the cost of those living elsewhere. The hydro rates are a burden for a community already struggling with poverty and lack of jobs. Most households cannot afford the cost to heat their homes, and as a result, live in precarious situations.

Recently we brought in a high-voltage expert. He used the term that for us in our community, we have “dirty lines.” I still struggle to understand what that means. But there’s a high fluctuation of low power brownouts and power surges that are affecting the life, health and safety of my citizens, because homes have actually started fires because of appliances that get affected by the surges.

Those high rates and the dirty lines, due to being at the end of the hydro line when the power meters are adjusted…. Terrace becomes first, and then Rosswood, New Aiyansh, Canyon City, Greenville and then my community. It affects it very much. We’re very concerned that we’re paying a premium for B.C. Hydro, but we’re getting services that are subpar. It should not be that way.

We feel very strongly that we need to come up with an alternative, so we’ve submitted a proposal for $200,000 that will give us that ability to look at alternative energy. Right now we’re looking at solar panels. Those solar panels will be located first on our recreational centre. It’s a $12 million facility that’s been constructed. We’re also going to put panels on one home to give us an idea on how that will be best managed.

We’ll go back to page 1. A harbour upgrade project. Gingolx Village Government seeks funding to improve and expand its existing harbour. Right now, we’re one of seven communities in the province that has road access to a natural deep-sea port. It’s ice-free year-round. Right now, the rating that we’re looking at is 70-metric-tonne ships that can come in to our port. We’re looking to provide and expand and improve the ability to use that. We feel that’s a very high economic development project. We’re looking at not only servicing Gingolx; we’re looking at servicing the whole northwest.

Granite rock quarry. My community…. Actually, the subdivision that we’re proposing is located on a 70-year supply of high-grade granite rock that’s acid-free. It’s ready to be put in the water as armour rock. That 70-year supply provides careers — not just short-term jobs for our citizens but careers — that would welcome back the 1,600 other citizens to our community and drive the economy for my community.

Just with regard to the rock quarry and the port facility, we’ve had Asian interest coming and saying to us: “Tell us where you want the port built. We’ll build it, and it doesn’t cost you anything.” So we’re looking to our treaty partners to be able to provide some sort of funding that would help us not to supply the Asian interest but to look at B.C. first and then move forward from there.

Highway upgrade is a big concern. The highway has come into our community for 13 years, and already, 16 percent grades, 13 percent grades suffer from freeze and thaw over the past 13 years.

[10:05 a.m.]

There are many potholes in my community. If you come here to Gingolx, you will experience a roller-coaster ride. Some of it has been because the bedding that the highway sits on was not done to the highway standards.

My community…. When the highway was built, we supplied $1.3 million of our money toward the highway being constructed. I don’t know if that’s something anyone else in the province has done — paid to have a road come to your community. So we look at the province and our treaty partners to be able to address that with us.

The end of it is local paving. My community is the only community that doesn’t have paving in our village. We’re looking at completing that. We’ve submitted proposals to the province to be able to do that, but in the meantime, my community has secured other funding to take care of all of the infrastructure so that we do not need to disturb the pavement once it’s installed. We don’t need to disturb it for 25 to 35 years. So we’re taking care of all of the underground and the infrastructure works.

Arts and culture and language are big priorities. A former vision statement said that Gingolx village government is dedicated to the preservation of our unique Nisg̱a’a language and culture, as directed by our elders. We’ve constructed a long house. We’ve constructed an adult learning centre. We’re in discussion with our elders to provide an access to preserve the Nisg̱a’a language in my community.

Compared to 30 years ago, 5 percent are fluent. So 5 percent are fluent; they can read, write, understand and speak. The 95 percent fluctuate between that ability. So preserving…. We’ve met with Minister Beare a couple of times to talk about our approach.

The last one that we want to talk about is tourism in our community. It’s accessible by water, air and land. In 1997, we identified cultural tourism as our number one priority, and we’ve been working towards that ever since. Our vision statement that’s been adopted by the past term of council is that we are Git Gingolx of the Nisg̱a’a Nation, a thriving coastal community and a destination of choice. So cultural tourism….

Our experiment — some of you might have heard of Crab Fest, a two-day festival that brought in the likes of Trooper, Nazareth, Dr. Hook, Chilliwack, Tom Jackson and Buffy Sainte-Marie. The one day that we had Trooper and Nazareth performing on the same day in my community…. My 372 members grew in that one day to about 8,000. We housed them. We fed them. We took care of them. We entertained them. We sent them back home with memories that are never forgotten. So we look forward to being partners in tourism, especially cultural tourism with our partners in the province.

In closing, coastal communities have much to offer, and Budget 2020 — we use the term “with clarity of purpose” — must assist my unique B.C. coastal community as we achieve our visions of growing British Columbia together. Thank you.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Thank you very much, George. We really appreciate that.

N. Simons: Chief Councillor and councillors, thank you very much. It was a very comprehensive presentation that you gave us. I have been on that road, and I remember a pothole or two. I think that it is a unique community and has a lot to offer. I liked hearing about the musical acts that…. Bob over there is a lawyer for musicians. He probably knows everybody there.

[10:10 a.m.]

You started with housing. Earlier today we heard about the homelessness situation here, in the larger communities. There was some implication that housing in the villages is there for residents, if they wish. My understanding, having worked in communities on the coast, is that the housing is sometimes older housing stock. The insulation isn’t quite as good as it could be. Issues around the number of people living in the homes all have an impact on the quality of life.

I don’t mean to distract from the village you’re representing. But other communities in similar circumstances…. Would you say there are housing pressures that need to be addressed in all the villages of Nisg̱a’a?

G. Moore: As one of the executive members for Lisims government, and not to speak in any way for Lisims government…. Speaking as an executive member, I’ve heard other communities talking about similar situations. It is a high priority.

R. Coleman: Thanks, George. A couple of questions. First of all, on the housing piece, in order to do housing, do you have to go through the Lisims government, or can you actually do it locally and decide that you have control of the land to do the housing? That would be my first question.

G. Moore: With Lisims government, there is about a $1.4 million budget on an annual basis, from which my community derives $374,000. That’s been in existence since the treaty came into play.

So yes, we do applications on an annual basis. In order to service some of the greater needs for some of our younger single people that are part of a larger demographic, we have been providing one- and two-bedroom multiplex units, six-plex units. This year we’re doing, within budget, a fourplex unit that’s being constructed as we speak.

R. Coleman: But 360 doesn’t build you 40 homes, right?

G. Moore: Yeah.

R. Coleman: So do you have other sources of funding — provincial, federal — that you’ve applied for, for that housing?

G. Moore: We are actively seeking other funding agencies right now.

R. Coleman: Just out of curiosity, what’s the name of the port?

G. Moore: Gingolx.

R. Coleman: If you’re looking at deep-water ports on the west coast, that would be one.

G. Moore: Yeah. We have inherited — through the ports divestiture program from Canada. We had the potential to take two. In the wisdom of council of that day, we assumed responsibility for the port of Gingolx. It was called Kincolith back then. Since the treaty came into being, the name change followed.

R. Coleman: What would be the anticipated product being shipped out of that port? You said 16 percent grade. Do you have rail access, or is it all road access?

G. Moore: In the history — I believe it was CN Rail at that time — they talked about through the Cranberry Junction, providing rail access to the community. Our highway initially was projected to come in through the back side of the community, on the upriver side, not along the Nass River where it comes right now.

That access we’re talking about for the industrial case is to come back in through that more level area. So they’re avoiding the 16 and 13 percent grades.

R. Coleman: What product is the first…? In discussions with your Asian suitors, for lack of a better description, what product are you looking at — a container port–type situation or product?

G. Moore: When the city of Prince Rupert was constructing its port and they had a conference in the city of Prince Rupert, we attended and talked about haulback opportunities and becoming partners or a sister port to the city of Prince Rupert and that port authority. Those discussions have not yet continued.

We still have that interest: providing arts, other crafts we’ve talked about; small sheds, smokehouses that are prepackaged that you can ship in containers, ten to each container, wherever supply and demand existed; and yes, mostly granite rock, and not all of it as armour rock due to the quality of the rock.

[10:15 a.m.]

We’re also talking more locally about kitchen countertops, vanity tops. We’re talking about monument stones more locally that we pay a high price to, to bring in a monument stone for some of our deceased citizens. So we’re looking at providing jobs locally to do both the countertops and the monument stones.

R. Coleman: Do you mine the rock now?

G. Moore: No. We have permission from Lisims government to go ahead and do it. We have not yet activated the B.C. mining permit — that portion of it — until we’re sure that we can bring a ship or some of the larger barges that would beach in our community, dock in our community, and the rock trucks literally rolling from the mine site to dumping their rocks onto a barge.

R. Coleman: Is it permitted now? Is taking the rock out permitted now?

G. Moore: Yeah. It is.

R. Coleman: So it’s just a matter of when you find a market and equipment.

G. Moore: My council or succeeding councils…. We know that elections are coming up fairly soon. Hopefully, we’re all back, but there’s no guarantee. We’ll look at that portion of it, activating the B.C. mining act permit.

R. Coleman: That’s a pretty good product — acid-free granite rock.

G. Moore: We have demand right now from Los Angeles. From previous experience as the chief executive officer for my community, we have established demands both from Asian countries and from Los Angeles for high-rise construction — so crushed rock being shipped that way.

D. Ashton (Deputy Chair): Chief councillor, councillors, thank you very much for your good presentation today. Very informative for myself.

Just a word to take a look at the Belt and Road nation that you spoke of, which has advanced funds all around the world to many nations. They have now started collecting from those nations the money that was lent.

There’s an incredibly good article in the new Economist magazine. I would strongly encourage somebody that was looking at offshore financing, specifically from the Belt and Road nation, to have a look at that article, first of all.

The product that you just spoke of with my peer, Rich Coleman, is a product that could be utilized everywhere. I wish you the most success for it. It’s something that is needed — yesterday. Please, if you are successful, and I hope you are, that that opportunity presents itself and you’re able to get that quarry under work and get it shipping.

G. Moore: We appreciate those comments. On June 24, we have a meeting with one of our neighbouring communities and a group from China that are talking about that exact opportunity. So we’re looking at that discussion.

D. Ashton (Deputy Chair): Just get a hold of The Economist magazine, first of all. It’s only words that are printed on paper, but along with the gift of money came the gift of obligation to pay it back.

G. Moore: Appreciate that. We’ll definitely pick it up.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Just a quick question. Have you talked to Minister Scott Fraser in regards to the language funding? There is $50 million available for language development.

G. Moore: With Minister Fraser directly?

B. D’Eith (Chair): Sorry, with the ministry.

G. Moore: Yeah. We have had discussions with Minister Beare — some members of her staff. At this point, we’re looking at those opportunities to focus on language preservation, specifically, and there are some inroads from the province with regard to festival funding.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Oh, great. Around the crab fest?

G. Moore: Yeah.

B. D’Eith (Chair): That’s wonderful. That sounded like a really good time. I think I’d like to come to that.

Then the other issue…. Housing funding has been opened up on reserve — for provincial funding. Have you talked to Selina Robinson’s ministry about the housing piece at all, or the Housing ministry?

G. Moore: We have had a series of meetings with the Ministry of Transportation.

B. D’Eith (Chair): With Claire Trevena.

G. Moore: The Ministry of Arts and Culture.

B. D’Eith (Chair): You might want to talk to the Ministry of Housing, because that’s been opened up. That’s a relatively new thing.

G. Moore: Our plan right now is if we cannot secure a meeting between now and UBCM in September…. We’re looking at scheduling a meeting with Minister Robinson at that meeting.

[10:20 a.m.]

B. D’Eith (Chair): Then you’d meet at UBCM. Okay. Perfect.

Ronna-Rae, did you have a comment?

R. Leonard: No, that’s okay. I was wanting to talk about the housing funds that are available for on reserve.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Doug, did you have a comment?

D. Clovechok: Yeah. Just a quick comment to the chief councillor and the councillors as well. Congratulations on your quest for cultural tourism. There’s a huge international market for it. My question would be: where are you with your development of that tourism component? What do you need to get it to where you need it to be?

G. Moore: Right now we’ve had somebody come in, a geologist, to do core samples. We know the extent of the granite rock in the mountain. We went from a 30-year supply to a 50-year supply to a 70-year supply of high-grade granite rock in that geologist’s report. Because it was in favour of another group that was trying to develop a partnership with us — that refused to meet with my community locally for consultations, beyond one meeting — that relationship ended. We saw no reason to continue with it. The whole idea, on that side of it, just to finish off…. That relationship ended.

With tourism, we’re talking about cultural tourism. We’ve been to Los Angeles; we’ve been to New York. With the Canada Media Marketplace initiative, we’ve done our presentations there for three years. That has brought a large amount of attention to my community. Actual tourism dollars, right now, we’re looking for from the province. Every source that we can try to access, we’re trying to access actively now. Hard tourism dollars, as they exist right now, are very little.

N. Simons: I just want to say that I think it took you a while to get here today. We appreciate hearing from you. We know that it’s not just a trip down the roads. You’ve got to go around potholes. I know that. I’d just say that we appreciate your presence.

B. D’Eith (Chair): Yes. Thank you very much for your presentation.

D. Clovechok: In my language, we say soka’pii, which means “very good.”

B. D’Eith (Chair): Awesome. Thank you very much.

A motion to adjourn.

Motion approved.

The committee adjourned at 10:23 a.m.